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Topic: how much to spend on cables? (Read 15347 times) previous topic - next topic
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how much to spend on cables?

Sorry, total newbie here. Looking to put together my first real audio setup, and wanted to get some forum advice before I started purchasing. Total budget for everything is around 5K.

I was wondering how much of my budget I should spend on interconnects and speaker cables? I've seen figures between 1% of 15%. Searching around online, the consensus for the other components seemed to be about 30-40% speakers, 30-40% amp & preamp, and 20-30% source....?

Thanks so much for the help 

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #1 –
 Let the fireworks begin 

Short answer: Only as much as needed to get a reasonably well-made set of cables with good shielding (interconnects), low capacitance and resistance. Because cables are one area where "everyone" hears a difference until proper ABX testing is done. Monoprice is your friend. $100 buys a lot of cable from Monoprice.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #2 –
I believe that speakers should take as much as possible of your whole budget. Rest makes too small difference to bother with it, AFAIK there are no studies proving audible differences between amps/dacs/cables.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #3 –
Monoprice indeed.
FLAC -> JDS Labs ODAC/O2 -> Sennheiser HD 650 (equalized)

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #5 –
Some of your equipment might come with cables.  There's no need to upgrade unless one of the cables breaks.

The big problem with Monoprice is you can end-up spending more for the shipping than for the cable.    And, that's NOT because the shipping is expensive! 

Their heavy-duty heavy-duth premium cables are less expensive than regular light-weight cables from an audio/video store.    And, their standard cables (which are perfectly acceptable) are also a great bargain.

For speaker cable over normal "home audio" distances, any 16 gauge* wire is more than adequate.  Just make sure the wire is marked with a stripe or otherwise "polarized" so the left & right speakers (and/or surround speakers) don't get wired out-of-phase relative to each other.  Normal "zip cord" from your local hardware store is fine as long as it's polarized.    Anything sold as "speaker wire" will be polarized. 

Quote
Sorry, total newbie here. Looking to put together my first real audio setup, and wanted to get some forum advice before I started purchasing. Total budget for everything is around 5K.
Speakers, speakers, speakers.    Basically, every receiver, CD/DVD player, etc., will sound alike and every speaker will sound different.    With your budget you probably don't want the cheapest receiver, but don't expect a higher priced receiver to sound any better (except you might want to get one with some kind "room correction", and that will affect the sound if you use it.)



* In case you don't already know this, smaller wire gauges have larger diameter.    i.e. 14AWG wire is "fatter" than 18AWG wire.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #6 –
Home Depot. The #12 or #14 stranded power cord makes superb speaker cables.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #7 –
Every system is different, so you'll get a lot of different opinions on this one.  A friend of mine has an incredible setup with Tara Labs Omega Gold speaker cables, which are the most expensive single component in his system.

Some people believe that speaker cables make a huge difference, others say it's snake oil. 

Personally, I don't like the idea of dividing a set percentage of your budget in to each component.  Trust your ears above all else.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #9 –
People who say,

Quote from: charlieclarke on
Every system is different

generally have no clue what the true implications are when they say,

Quote from: charlieclarke on
Trust your ears above all else.

http://www.hydrogenaud.io/forums/index.php?showtopic=16295

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #10 –
Quote from: charlieclarke on
Every system is different, so you'll get a lot of different opinions on this one.


Right, when you are talking about unsupported opinions everything goes.

But here's a different approach for you. Why not use reliable evidence as the basis for forming your plan of action?

Quote
A friend of mine has an incredible setup with Tara Labs Omega Gold speaker cables, which are the most expensive single component in his system.


OK this guy lost his mind and overspent wildly on cables.  This did not hurt how his system sounds. What course of action can one logically base on that?

Quote
Some people believe that speaker cables make a huge difference, others say it's snake oil.


The ones who say it is snake oil probably looked at reliable evidence. The ones who say they make a huge difference probably based their opinions on sighted evaluations which are utter garbage as reliable evidence goes.

Quote
Personally, I don't like the idea of dividing a set percentage of your budget in to each component.


So what is your evidence that supports that opinon? A feeling in your gut?  Science?


Quote
Trust your ears above all else.


Trusting your ears would probably be a better idea if it wasn't that your ears are connected to your brain which is very prone to biases and suggestions.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #11 –
Quote
A friend of mine has an incredible setup with Tara Labs Omega Gold speaker cables, which are the most expensive single component in his system.
  That literally made me laugh out loud!

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #12 –
Electronic part supply stores offer no-frills installer grade audio cables in every variety and at reasonable prices when compared to most audio stores or big box retailers. For example, here's the audio cable selection at my local place ~ B&E Electronics
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?  ;~)

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #13 –
what about connectors? Do those make any audible difference? And what about reliability issues and longevity? Does that come into play when picking a cable? What are the basic necessities of cables?

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #14 –
Here you go; 100ft of 12 gauge OFC stranded cable. $50, and thick enough to impress your friends. It's absolute overkill.
I would go with flat stranded 16 gauge for unobtrusive under-carpet and up-wall runs.

Now spend the vast majority of the rest of your time and money auditioning speakers, and then spend a while positioning them.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #15 –
Quote from: Heisenberg on
what about connectors? Do those make any audible difference? And what about reliability issues and longevity? Does that come into play when picking a cable?

In my experience, I've come to much prefer factory versus hand crimped or soldered connections both for reliability and time. For a large installation, I once bought bulk wire and bulk connectors and in the end, I didn't save enough cash to offset the extra time and effort. Generally cables fail at the connectors from either repeated or excessive strain or poor design or poor construction. It's important to pull directly on the connector and not just the wire when unplugging things. I've also seen wires damaged from traffic.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?  ;~)

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #16 –
Quote from: Heisenberg on
what about connectors? Do those make any audible difference? And what about reliability issues and longevity? Does that come into play when picking a cable? What are the basic necessities of cables?


You bet connectors make a difference: Back in my audiophile days, I bought a bunch of Cxxxxs's top-of-the-line, silver-rhodium plated copper billet RCA plugs and jacks. Great looking stuff. But as it turned out, copper isn't a great material for the application because the soft metal erodes pretty quickly, and after a few years I found myself frequently jiggling the connectors to restore signal.  Any RCA connectors which rely in precise fit rather than compensating for wear should probably be avoided.

Even when Brand C connectors were working properly, I can't say that I ever heard a difference between them or the inexpensive parts that come pre-mounted on a sheet of phenolic (even tinned steel), as long as the surfaces were clean and making good contact. I feel that the most reliable connectors are made of hard springy stamped metals, and usually pretty cheap.

As for plating, nickel is good stuff: hard-wearing, resists oxidation. Gold looks nice but for interconnect use, I haven't noticed any differences versus nickel, tin or silver-rhodium, nor Teflon versus other dielectrics (but I prefer dielectrics which withstand soldering abuse).

I might pay extra for connectors with features like breaking signal before ground.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #17 –
My entire audio system is cabled for probably less than $15 worth of monoprice cables. Sounds great!

Buy a good amp, with desired features being your price justification over claims of audio quality, but as many have said here, speakers, speakers, speakers. Again, try to avoid snake oil. Really good speakers don't have to be tremendously expensive.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #18 –
For what its worth, i've never used a monoprice cable I didn't like. 

We use them in the lab with equipment that costs more than a sports car.  Just pick the right cage and type for your application and you'll be fine.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #19 –
Who are Monoprice? I'm guessing it's an American company?

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #20 –
And even speakers, once you get to a certain level (ie 2 or 3 decent sized drive units per floor standing speaker in a fair sized cabinet), then the $1000, or $10000 or $100000 speaker there is little between them (if you ask me). You are paying for a name, and possibly design fashion.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #21 –
Quote from: 2tec on
Quote from: Heisenberg on
what about connectors? Do those make any audible difference? And what about reliability issues and longevity? Does that come into play when picking a cable?

In my experience, I've come to much prefer factory versus hand crimped or soldered connections both for reliability and time. For a large installation, I once bought bulk wire and bulk connectors and in the end, I didn't save enough cash to offset the extra time and effort. Generally cables fail at the connectors from either repeated or excessive strain or poor design or poor construction. It's important to pull directly on the connector and not just the wire when unplugging things. I've also seen wires damaged from traffic.


Bell labs has probably done more research into wire connections than anybody, and they have long been strong advocates of crimped connections made with suffient pressure to literally weld the two conductors together. Doing this right and reliably usually takes a machine with some tool steel dies that makes a horrible noise when operated.

However for last 20-30 years they have also been advocating these for connections in the field:



Basically the wire gets forced into a v-shaped notch that partially crushes it but mainly exposes fresh metal, and the whole works is packed inside some silicon gel that keeps the freshly exposed metal fresh.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #22 –
Yeah, Monoprice, or Blue Jeans which is not that expensive but the cables are built like tanks, and AFAIK they use professional-grade components. I would spend also some of it on a nice receiver. If you're doing home theater you might want to look into which features are better for you. I'm sure you get recommended expensive amps, if people have told you to spend up to 15% of 5K (!) on cables. I would just get a kickass receiver. With modern devices there are integrated features that will make your music playing easier, like network connection, Airplay or even bluetooth. If you're looking for a universal remote, I'm loving the Logitech Smart Control: http://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/harm...control?crid=60 I only use the remote though, the app on the phone is pretty much worthless for controlling anything, I just use it for set up.

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #23 –
Quote
Who are Monoprice? I'm guessing it's an American company?
Yes.  Monoprice.com is a U.S. online retailer. 

I'm fairly certain they are not a manufacturer, but some of their merchandise is branded "Monoprice".

how much to spend on cables?

Reply #24 –
When you buy something that needs a connecting cable which isn't supplied, simply ask for one to be included in the price or refuse to buy.

Remember, the customer is always right!