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Topic: Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues. (Read 5281 times) previous topic - next topic
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Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Hi,

I'm confused, very confused in fact. All these Vorbis binaries, ICL compiled, MSVC compiled, hacked for use in buggy applications (CDex), hacked for use in WinLame...


    It'd be nice if anyone could clear all this up. I know, mostly silly questions, but that's what happens if you don't keep track of the forum... sorry guys

    CU

    Dominic

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #1
OK... let's clarify things.

Quote
Originally posted by Volcano

There was once a hacked version of Vorbis.dll for CDex, because CDex mapped the maximum bitrate to the minimum bitrate setting (or something similar). This bug has been fixed... so, naturally, that means there is no problem using a "normal" Vorbis.dll in CDex, right?


Right.

Quote
Is the vorbis.dll included in dailyvorbis.zip a "normal" one, or is it in any way hacked?


100% normal vorbis.dll, compiled from the CDex sources + latest xiph sources.

Quote
Are the files in dailyvorbis.zip ICL compiled, as discussed in "Vorbis speedup in CVS"?
If this is so, that means the up-to-date binaries are no longer available as MSVC compiles, does it?


Yes, nearly all the files at my site are ICL compiles.

You can get non-ICL daily compiles (made by John33 too) at Benjamin's site - I guess it's at  "Aktuell ohne Optimierung"
Although I doubt there's any advantage using VC6 compiles.

Quote
Is OGGDropXPd ICL compiled?


Yes.

Quote
What's up with the Vorbis DLLs for WinLame? You don't have to worry about these if you want to use Vorbis in CDex etc., do you?


No. These DLLs are exactly the same as libvorbis.dll, where they have been merged for convinience. The only reason they are there in separated form is because WinLame doesn't recognize them as libvorbis.dll.

Quote
It'd be nice if anyone could clear all this up. I know, mostly silly questions, but that's what happens if you don't keep track of the forum... sorry guys


No problem.

Regards;

Roberto.

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #2
Quote
100% normal vorbis.dll, compiled from the CDex sources + latest xiph sources.

Uhmm... why CDex sources? :confused:

Thanks for your reply

Dominic

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #3
clarification from my side: Winamp in/out plugins no longer use any external vorbis dlls due to stability/compatibility issues with weird dlls people keep on their systems. ICL builds are (temporarily?) not available. i'm still waiting for "stable" standard of vorbis encoder dll.
Microsoft Windows: We can't script here, this is bat country.

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #4
Quote
Originally posted by Volcano
Uhmm... why CDex sources? :confused:


Vorbis.dll isn't standard vorbis library. The standard vorbis libraries are ogg.dll, vorbis.dll, vorbisenc.dll and vorbisfile.dll. IIRC, libvorbis.dll was created by John33 to merge together the above 4 dlls.

Vorbis.dll was created by Albert Faber (CDex author) specifically for CDex. Don't ask me why he didn't use the official libs. Probably he wanted a one-dll solution too. Besides, vorbis.dll has some of the functionalities stripped, like decoding.

That's why you can only find Vorbis.dll sources at CDex sources.

Regards;

Roberto.

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #5
Quote
Originally posted by rjamorim
Vorbis.dll isn't standard vorbis library. The standard vorbis libraries are ogg.dll, vorbis.dll, vorbisenc.dll and vorbisfile.dll. IIRC, libvorbis.dll was created by John33 to merge together the above 4 dlls.

*hits his head*
I always thought the Vorbis.dll was an official Xiph.org thing -same for libVorbis.dll!  Damn.

What do the individual official libraries (ogg.dll, vorbis.dll, vorbisenc.dll, vorbisfile.dll) do, then? (OK I can guess vorbisenc's task , but what about the others...)

CU

Dominic

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #6
Hi,

Quote
Quote

What's up with the Vorbis DLLs for WinLame? You don't have to worry about these if you want to use Vorbis in CDex etc., do you? 


No. These DLLs are exactly the same as libvorbis.dll, where they have been merged for convinience. The only reason they are there in separated form is because WinLame doesn't recognize them as libvorbis.dll.


as with winLAME rd12, winLAME can use the libvorbis.dll or the official 4 DLL's, when they are present. winLAME is delivered with a reasonable new compile of the libvorbis.dll. Theoretically, there's no need for the separate download for winLAME anymore.

Quote
What do the individual official libraries (ogg.dll, vorbis.dll, vorbisenc.dll, vorbisfile.dll) do, then? (OK I can guess vorbisenc's task , but what about the others...) 


ogg.dll contains functions for the ogg container format, vorbisenc.dll has functions to set up encoding, vorbis.dll does all the work with encoding and vorbisfile.dll simplifies access (read/write) to ogg vorbis files.

bye
vividos

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #7
ogg: ogg bitstream wrapper
vorbisenc: encoding setup interface
vorbis: the Vorbis specification by  Xiphophorus
vorbisfile: "convenience library built on Vorbis designed to simplify common uses and a number of GPL example programs" (from the CVS readme)

Regards;

Roberto.

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #8
Roberto, et al, have all this quite correct!

Just as an aside, CDex 1.50 beta now uses the 4 official dlls, ie., vorbis.dll, vorbisenc.dll, vorbisfile.dll and ogg.dll. The original (Faber authored) vorbis.dll will become obsolete with CDex 1.50.

john33

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #9
Thank goodness.  We don't need any more confusion over what is official and what isn't, so that step is very welcome...

The thing is, CDex is not the only program that uses the non-standard Vorbis DLL, Audiograbber, for instance, also does. What about that?

Roberto / vividos: Thanks

CU

Dominic

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #10
With regard to the demise of Faber's CDex vorbis.dll, I suspect Release 1.50 beta is someway from happening and, in the meantime an while 1.40 is current, the dll will continue to be provided by me. In fact, I will continue to provide it for as long as there is any demand for it.

If AudioGrabber continues to use it, I'll continue to provide it if there is any demand.

john33

Roberto, John33: Need clarification on Vorbis binary issues.

Reply #11
Hacks:

On another note, correct me if I am wrong, but I think Monty loves to try to incorporate various hacks into most of the files he works with. For instance JohnV told me that he incorperated an IIR Lowpass filter hack to use with the -q switch in Vorbis RC3, that which is not bitstream dependent, but rather depends on the value for the switch you use determines how much lowpass filtering is applied to the output, for instance a quality switch that might allow a variable bitstream between ~96 - ~120 kbps, would more than likely apply a 16.2 kHz IIR lowpass filter, if you where to look at it on a spectrogram, or even by looking at the upper  bands that where filtered in while Winamp was decoding the stream.

Libraries:

I think Monty said they he wanted to make it so that in the future everyone would be able to compile there own version of libvorbis rather than having to use the official libraries, for there own conviences I believe that still holds true.

All the Libraries mentioned below by roberto are correct.
budding I.T professional