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Topic: Speakers or Heaphones? (Read 3829 times) previous topic - next topic
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Speakers or Heaphones?

Hello folks,

  I've decided to invest some money in a better audio setup, largely driven by a pc.  I was wondering what would be a more cost effective solution,  investing ~400USD in speakers or a headphone + amp combination.  For speakers, I'm currently looking at the Mission m71s, with an integrated amp (I'm open to suggestions).  The headphone/amp combination would likely be Sennheiser HD580s (I've noticed you can get these for ~150USD now) with a HeadRoom amp.  Does anyone have experience with either of these setups?  (My sound card's an audigy, which I'll probably upgrade to an M-audio card later.)  I've heard stories from folks claiming that decent headphone amps will provide soundstaging, as opposed to the annoying "voice above your head" sensation you get with un-amped cans, while I've also heard from speaker evangelists who would swear that under no circumstances could a set of cans beat a stereo setup.  What are your opinions of this?

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #1 –
This is purely a matter of personal preference. I find speakers more enjoyable because I can feel the bass with my chest. Headphones are not susceptible to room acoustics, but are somewhat unnatural. I always get the urge to take them off after listening for a while... you know what I mean. So if I were not at work I'd be using speakers.

I wish I could suggest a good setup within your cost range, but I don't know much beyond Altec Lansing.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #2 –
I have to disagree with Doctor in the sense that although there are personal preferences at play with both, for the best bang for buck question, headphones win hands down... by a significant factor.

Spend some time over at Head-Fi to see your options. Some other sites worth note- Computers And Music, HeadSave Amps, JMTAudio Amps, GradoLabs Headphones.

The Senn 580's are great cans independent of their price, but you should really try others to find your preference. I've tested 580's for a week and personally liked the Grado sound better (at least off my HeadSave Ultra and M-Audio Audiophile USB). The 225's can be found around for approximately $175. The Beyer DT880's and Etys 4 series should also be looked at.

$400 can get you a lot of equipment.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #3 –
There are a few more things to be considered than cost.  Number one would be do you plan to move around when you listen to music?  If you do, scratch the headphones.  Also, you could opt for good headphones now and get the speakers down the line.  You needn't try to solve all your problems with the one purchase. 

I have listened to the Paradigm speakers, made by those ever nefarious Canadians.  I have always been impressed by their quality, but I am listening with my ears.  Yours might hear differently.  They are worth a listen.

I have some cheap Sennsheisers and a pair of Etymotics for "serious"      headphone listening.  My PC has some junk Harmon-Kardon speakers which came with the DELL as an added cost item.  They are alright.  My real stereo is in storage and is pretty high end ( ~2000 - 2400 watts power total from two mono-blocked amps, large 6' electrostatic speakers, etc.) but is in storage.  I will have it up and running in a year or less.  Now I am content with what I have.  That in itself is a blessing.

For audio equipment always be guided by your ears.    B)
Nov schmoz kapop.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #4 –
Quote
This is purely a matter of personal preference. I find speakers more enjoyable because I can feel the bass with my chest.

if you really want to feel bass in your chest, i think you will have to invest some more than 400 US$ ...

From my point of view, a decent pair headphones with adequate amplification is a good way to start into HiFi ... but I agree with the doctor when it comes to loudspeaker experience since headphones do not shine iwhen it comes to reproduction of staging information which leads directly to your favourite music (classical, rock, electronic, techno) because each type of music has different demands towards playback equipment's capabilities ...

"best buy" would definitely be a pair of headphones, though ... BTW, my 600's are so efficient that they can be played on portable devices as well and still maintaining enough sound pressure to make me feel good ...
The name was Plex The Ripper, not Jack The Ripper

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #5 –
With $400, I'd get a Headroom Little amp and Sennheiser 580 headphones (I know, it's $450).

This is the exact setup I run at home on my computer and I have very little desire to upgrade (this from a guy who has a $1500 headphone setup at work).  I might add an outboard DAC since I have one sitting around.

With this (or a similar) setup, you'll get exceptional sound, far better than from some small speakers and an integrated amp.  You'll get bass to 20 Hz but, no, it won't thump your chest.  And, since most sound card drivers can optimize for headphones, you can get pretty good surround effects from games.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #6 –
I have some headphones that cause me to "hallucinate" floor-vibrating, chest thumping bass sometimes (not the Senn HD-580)... still not the same as speakers though, where it can actually happen.

Something like the Sony V6 / MDR-7506 could produce the kind of low bass that will "vibrate your head" and give the subwoofer-ish illusion.  I think one would want fairly large, closed/sealed headphones with an emphasized (but "clean") bass response for that.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #7 –
Thanks for the replies.  Floor-thumping bass might not be a good thing, because I'm still in a dorm, with an apartment in the future.  The subwoofer control on my Klipsches are generally left <30%, or people start complaining.  Chances are that I'll be picking up some headphones and a cheap amp to start me out.  What about soundstaging with an amp?  I'll mostly be listening to classical, some pop/rock, jazz and blues.  I'm not sure entry-level speakers would have good soundstaging, either.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #8 –
The Sennheiser HD-580 or HD-600 is a good recommendation if you listen mostly to classical (instrument realism).  My HD-580 doesn't "rock" well because of its open, airy quality and "diffuse field" equalization, but it does classical, pop, jazz, blues, etc. just fine.  For some reason it's especially nice with ambient/trance and new age music (probably something to do with the nature of the deep bass).

Some people say amps affect soundstaging, some say all well designed amps basically sound the same (i.e. differences can't be ABX'ed).  You might consider one of these (good amp with an excellent reputation, reasonable prices for what you get):

http://www.headsave.com

See "Headsave Ultra" for home use, or "Headsave Transit" for portable use.

(I'm unaffiliated)

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #9 –
Quote
Thanks for the replies.  Floor-thumping bass might not be a good thing, because I'm still in a dorm, with an apartment in the future.  The subwoofer control on my Klipsches are generally left <30%, or people start complaining.  Chances are that I'll be picking up some headphones and a cheap amp to start me out.  What about soundstaging with an amp?  I'll mostly be listening to classical, some pop/rock, jazz and blues.  I'm not sure entry-level speakers would have good soundstaging, either.

Go with the headphones/Amp combination.  The amount of money you spend on all that is essentially the amount of money you'd spend on any one component of a speaker setup (for a good one that is.  I don't know much about computer speakers, but I feel that a good stereo setup can smoke any computer speaker setup)

If you decide to go with the speaker setup anyways, I'd recommend Ascend Acoustics speakers. I've never read anything bad about them.  I like their sound and the speakers definitely sound larger than they actually are.  I've actually had to get up to make sure that there wasn't any sound coming from my center channel when I listened to stereo music.

But get a good subwoofer if you do get them.  It helps.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #10 –
For $400 it will be essentially impossible to find speakers that can match a good pair of ~$200 headphones in overall quality of response.
  A tour of ebay or a deeply discounted retailer could turn up a pair of speakers that might rival good headphones (say, a used pair of Paradigm, Definitive Tech. or NHT bookshelfs)  in the midrange and highs, but usable output is going to be cut-off at 40Hz, probably significantly higher. And you still need a decent amp, and a sub (if you want <~40Hz output).

  I'd say stick with headphones in this price range, especially since you appear to be in a dorm.
 
  I cannot recommend the HD580/600's strongly enough, since you mention you listen to a lot of classical music.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #12 –
Since you're concerned about "voice above your head" and soundstage issues, definitely make sure to look into a good hardware or software crossfeed solution. I don't know how people deal without it.

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #13 –
Quote
Since you're concerned about "voice above your head" and soundstage issues, definitely make sure to look into a good hardware or software crossfeed solution. I don't know how people deal without it.

By getting a pair of cans like the HD-580 that's diffuse field EQ'ed.  It isn't crossfeed, but the sound isn't inside or above my head either.  With good recordings, it does sound to me like it's coming from all directions (at minimum it keeps a sense of 'distance', which is surprisingly enough the most common complaint about the 580/600 -- and probably also the best liked 'feature' by people who like these cans).

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #14 –
Quote
I have some headphones that cause me to "hallucinate" floor-vibrating, chest thumping bass sometimes (not the Senn HD-580)... still not the same as speakers though, where it can actually happen.

Something like the Sony V6 / MDR-7506 could produce the kind of low bass that will "vibrate your head" and give the subwoofer-ish illusion.  I think one would want fairly large, closed/sealed headphones with an emphasized (but "clean") bass response for that.

You can make the Senn HD-580 to cause "hallucination" too. But need extreme bass boost. Try
izotope-ozone, equalizer @20Hz +15dB
plus izotope-ozone, tube amplifier bass compression +12dB
plus sb usb mp3+ speaker settings, bass boost @max
plus sb usb mp3+ equalizer @31Hz +12dB

Nah, you can leave this last one off. The others are sufficient  to cause the effect!

Speakers or Heaphones?

Reply #15 –
Just a practical note that I don't think anyone addressed.

You said you were in a dorm room.
I would suggest you consider the size/weight of what you buy
(thus giving the edge to headphones) simply because you will likely move a few
times in the next few years.  At least going on my own student experiences.

My speakers managed to barely survive being moved, and moved and moved again. They're mid-height jobs... I suppose bookshelf speakers would be easier to transport.

Good luck with your purchase.
DukeTogo