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24 bit vinyl clips, Examples of 24 bit vinyl and bit-reduced versions
Gretschguy
post Feb 15 2012, 19:03
Post #1





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Joined: 14-February 12
Member No.: 97144




Attached are several clips for vinyl rips, each in (24/48) and (16/44.1) -- I have many more but 7 I filled up my attachment space.

I used Izotope's SRC and MBit+ algorithms to do the conversion, I converted sample rate first and then bit rate.

The rips were done using Thorens Turntable, Lyra Delos cartride, Parasound phono pre, Burl B2 ADC, Lynx AES16 card, Pure Vinyl software.

If anyone has better conversion technology than Izotope I would be interested to hear those samples for my own comparison, as a practical matter I would like to have the best possible bit reduced versions in my library in addition to my 24 bit versions.

If anyone is interested in specific notes on what I'm hearing as the differences in my playback system then let me know.

The sources are:

Dire Straits "Romeo And Juliet"
Prefab Sprout "Faron Young"
Yes "Roundabout"
The National "Bloodbuzz Ohio"
Cat Stevens "Father And Son"
Roxy Music "Running Wild"
John Lennon "Mind Games"

Thanks for checking these out.




Attached File(s)
Attached File  Romeo_And_Juliet__30s___24_48_.wav ( 6.98MB ) Number of downloads: 171
Attached File  Romeo_And_Juliet__30s___16_44_.wav ( 4.31MB ) Number of downloads: 120
Attached File  Roundabout__30s___24_48_.wav ( 8.53MB ) Number of downloads: 90
Attached File  Roundabout__30s___16_44_.wav ( 5.27MB ) Number of downloads: 78
Attached File  Bloodbuzz_Ohio__30s___24_48_.wav ( 8.37MB ) Number of downloads: 88
Attached File  Bloodbuzz_Ohio__30s___16_44_.wav ( 5.16MB ) Number of downloads: 73
Attached File  Father_And_Son__30s___24_48_.wav ( 8.37MB ) Number of downloads: 102
Attached File  Father_And_Son__30s___16_44_.wav ( 5.17MB ) Number of downloads: 101
Attached File  Faron_Young__30s___24_48_.wav ( 7.9MB ) Number of downloads: 159
Attached File  Faron_Young__30s___16_44_.wav ( 4.88MB ) Number of downloads: 88
Attached File  Running_Wild__30s___16_44_.wav ( 5.11MB ) Number of downloads: 86
Attached File  Running_Wild__30s___24_48_.wav ( 8.27MB ) Number of downloads: 84
Attached File  Mind_Games__30s___16_44_.wav ( 5.05MB ) Number of downloads: 70
Attached File  Mind_Games__30s___24_48_.wav ( 8.24MB ) Number of downloads: 89
 
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2Bdecided
post Feb 20 2012, 14:34
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ReplayGain developer


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From: Yorkshire, UK
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Sorry to reply a third time!

I've been enjoying your samples in the other thread. Here are some thoughts...

1) They're very good. I can come close, but not consistently.

2) They all have a slight smiley EQ (boosted bass + treble) compared with the digital copies I can find. It seems fairly consistent, which is remarkable given the various sources. The only conclusion I can draw (unless anyone has another one) is that either the vinyl mastering, or your playback, adds this smiley EQ - intentionally or not.

3) There are examples where every digital copy I can find includes audibly reduced dynamics, while the vinyl copy you posted sounds fine. I wish the Romeo and Juliet sample had lasted longer - I suspect the loudest drum beat a few seconds later would have revealed an even greater difference.

4) Even when apparently perfect, there's something about the sound of them that I associate with analogue. People say things like "more air" as a good thing, but my best guess is its down to small amounts of wow/flutter, distortion, noise, and reverb-like properties which add to the signal in a "nice" way. I may be imagining it (can ABX due to DRC+EQ differences, so that doesn't help!), but that's what I think I hear in your samples.

This last point is interesting to me. I think it's what some people prefer about vinyl. Many people claim that the vinyl lets you hear more of the original, but having heard pure digital recordings have this "added" to them on vinyl, I'm convinced it's (almost?) all "nice" distortion, and not revealing "more" of the original.

Take this as pure speculation if you wish. I'm as guilty of placebo as anyone. Can anyone think of a way us mortals can test it properly?

Cheers,
David.

P.S. I can't hear a difference between the 16/44.1 and 24/48 versions.
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Gretschguy
post Feb 21 2012, 03:24
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QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Feb 20 2012, 15:34) *
Sorry to reply a third time!

I've been enjoying your samples in the other thread. Here are some thoughts...

1) They're very good. I can come close, but not consistently.

2) They all have a slight smiley EQ (boosted bass + treble) compared with the digital copies I can find. It seems fairly consistent, which is remarkable given the various sources. The only conclusion I can draw (unless anyone has another one) is that either the vinyl mastering, or your playback, adds this smiley EQ - intentionally or not.

3) There are examples where every digital copy I can find includes audibly reduced dynamics, while the vinyl copy you posted sounds fine. I wish the Romeo and Juliet sample had lasted longer - I suspect the loudest drum beat a few seconds later would have revealed an even greater difference.

4) Even when apparently perfect, there's something about the sound of them that I associate with analogue. People say things like "more air" as a good thing, but my best guess is its down to small amounts of wow/flutter, distortion, noise, and reverb-like properties which add to the signal in a "nice" way. I may be imagining it (can ABX due to DRC+EQ differences, so that doesn't help!), but that's what I think I hear in your samples.

This last point is interesting to me. I think it's what some people prefer about vinyl. Many people claim that the vinyl lets you hear more of the original, but having heard pure digital recordings have this "added" to them on vinyl, I'm convinced it's (almost?) all "nice" distortion, and not revealing "more" of the original.

Take this as pure speculation if you wish. I'm as guilty of placebo as anyone. Can anyone think of a way us mortals can test it properly?

Cheers,
David.

P.S. I can't hear a difference between the 16/44.1 and 24/48 versions.


David, thanks for the notes -- this is very interesting. Take a look also for more presence around 1k in modern CDs -- anecdotally that's what I'm seeing. I hypothesize (no proof) that vinyl sounds clearer to some people because those frequencies are not built up so much thus providing a little less subjective harshness and the vocal perhaps sounds clearer as the upper midrange is often (from what I see) a little boosted on vinyl. This is PURE speculation but worth checking out.

Also, when I use the term "air" I'm usually just referencing the upper frequencies (> 12k). It is short hand for saying "the upper high frequencies beyond about 12k". In mixing terms I see the term often used, when you add "air" you usually boost the highest frequencies available to you. I don't think of it as an pseudo science term at all -- now the word "engaging" is perhaps over the line, but I feel I really finally understood what that term meant when I actually started tapping my foot and bobbing my head to "Oh Yoko" off a vinyl rip because it sounded so fantastic (to me). smile.gif

Cheers for taking the time to have a listen.
GG










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Posts in this topic
- Gretschguy   24 bit vinyl clips   Feb 15 2012, 19:03
- - Wombat   It shouldn´t be of any advantage to use iZotope di...   Feb 15 2012, 19:35
- - Wombat   I gave this Faron Young sample a try and played it...   Feb 15 2012, 20:44
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (Wombat @ Feb 15 2012, 20:44) I gav...   Feb 15 2012, 21:57
|- - greynol   QUOTE (Gretschguy @ Feb 15 2012, 12:57) D...   Feb 15 2012, 22:09
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (greynol @ Feb 15 2012, 22:09) QUOT...   Feb 15 2012, 22:28
- - pdq   An interesting experiment for Gretschguy to perfor...   Feb 15 2012, 21:09
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (pdq @ Feb 15 2012, 21:09) An inter...   Feb 15 2012, 21:43
- - pdq   From the website for the DAC, it appears that it d...   Feb 15 2012, 21:52
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (pdq @ Feb 15 2012, 21:52) From the...   Feb 15 2012, 22:00
- - greynol   Let there be no doubt that any audible differences...   Feb 15 2012, 22:02
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (greynol @ Feb 15 2012, 22:02) Let ...   Feb 15 2012, 22:17
- - greynol   It's readily accepted that best practice is to...   Feb 15 2012, 22:21
- - Wombat   QUOTE (Gretschguy @ Feb 15 2012, 21:57) W...   Feb 15 2012, 22:31
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (Wombat @ Feb 15 2012, 23:31) QUOTE...   Feb 15 2012, 22:40
- - greynol   If you cannot demonstrate that what you're hea...   Feb 15 2012, 22:35
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (greynol @ Feb 15 2012, 23:35) If y...   Feb 15 2012, 22:41
- - AndyH-ha   What are you asking for? Do you have a problem to ...   Feb 15 2012, 22:39
- - mixminus1   @Gretschguy, a couple questions: 1) You said earl...   Feb 15 2012, 22:55
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (mixminus1 @ Feb 15 2012, 22:55) @G...   Feb 15 2012, 23:27
|- - greynol   QUOTE (Gretschguy @ Feb 15 2012, 14:27) M...   Feb 15 2012, 23:33
- - greynol   He could just up-convert to the highest bit depth/...   Feb 15 2012, 23:16
- - xnor   Thanks for the samples. A simple analysis showed t...   Feb 16 2012, 00:31
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (xnor @ Feb 16 2012, 01:31) Thanks ...   Feb 16 2012, 03:49
- - mjb2006   I wouldn't worry about using SoX. Izotope...   Feb 16 2012, 03:43
|- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (mjb2006 @ Feb 16 2012, 04:43) I wo...   Feb 16 2012, 03:51
- - cliveb   OK, I have listened to Gretschguy's vinyl clip...   Feb 16 2012, 10:17
- - 2Bdecided   Sorry to reply a third time! I've been en...   Feb 20 2012, 14:34
- - Gretschguy   QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Feb 20 2012, 15:34) So...   Feb 21 2012, 03:24


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