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Converting to WMA
polemon
post Jan 25 2011, 13:32
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Is there a Linux build of WMAenc? I mean something like LAME but for WMA and since it's closed source, I wonder if there's a windows build for it.
I'm not too much interested in using it, but I'd like to run some tests, since judging by what's on the Wikipedia page about WMA, there seems to be quite a lot of arguing going on about the quality WMA has...


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db1989
post Jan 25 2011, 13:45
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QUOTE (polemon @ Jan 25 2011, 12:32) *
I'd like to run some tests, since judging by what's on the Wikipedia page about WMA, there seems to be quite a lot of arguing going on about the quality WMA has...

From that article (Microsoft’s own outlandish claims aside):
QUOTE
Double blind listening tests with other lossy audio codecs have shown varying results, from failure to support Microsoft's claims about its superior quality to supremacy over other codecs.
The only test that purports to indicate the latter is this one:
QUOTE
At 64 kbit/s, WMA Pro outperformed Nero HE-AAC in a commissioned, independent listening test performed by the National Software Testing Labs in 2005. Out of 300 participants, "71% of all listeners indicated that WMA Pro was equal to or better than HE AAC."
The given link now redirects to a page that merely describes Windows Media codecs. Is there a functional link? Was the test double-blind, as the others organised by Hydrogenaudio members Sebastian Mares, rjamorim, etc. obviously were?

This post has been edited by dv1989: Jan 25 2011, 13:46
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polemon
post Jan 25 2011, 18:30
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QUOTE (dv1989 @ Jan 25 2011, 13:45) *
From that article (Microsoft’s own outlandish claims aside):
QUOTE
Double blind listening tests with other lossy audio codecs have shown varying results, from failure to support Microsoft's claims about its superior quality to supremacy over other codecs.
The only test that purports to indicate the latter is this one:
QUOTE
At 64 kbit/s, WMA Pro outperformed Nero HE-AAC in a commissioned, independent listening test performed by the National Software Testing Labs in 2005. Out of 300 participants, "71% of all listeners indicated that WMA Pro was equal to or better than HE AAC."

All I can conclude from that article, is that results were inconclusive, so I decided to make my own testing. Also, that Test were 71% said it outperforms HE-AAC, is already almost six years old, there has been a number of releases of NeroAAC in the meantime.


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jaro1
post Jan 29 2011, 15:10
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QUOTE (mudlord @ Jan 23 2011, 13:54) *
QUOTE
It is always more convenient to use only one executable file for encoding...


Started to write a native Windows Media Audio encoder though...so no outside DLLs.


It will be great to create cmd wma encoder, that will depend only on system dll (wmadmoe.dll). Will it be difficult to do it with pipe support (without the need to create tmp file at first)?
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Merlin_de
post Jan 31 2011, 02:29
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QUOTE (jaro1 @ Jan 29 2011, 15:10) *
It will be great to create cmd wma encoder, that will depend only on system dll (wmadmoe.dll). Will it be difficult to do it with pipe support (without the need to create tmp file at first)?


pipe support is easy, the main work is stupid coz we need one way for the old wm9 support and a second way for the new media foundation.

the basswma.dll dev make a great work and do all this for us. it is designed as a free lib.
1. it is portable coz user dont need to register the dll.
2. we can use the my WMAencoder independent from foobar and convert eg flac or other codec direct from source to wma (not yet implement: basswv.dll, bass_ape.dll, bassflac.dll bassmidi.dll, bass_aac.dll ..... etc)
3. bass.dll has direct pipe support

it is no problem to put the dll inside the exe file, but this only grow up the exe file size
i like the design of the bass plugins coz it is very expandable and user-friendly biggrin.gif

feel free to reinvent the wheel again (to code all this again and again)
i think you dont have the know how and the time to do this rolleyes.gif
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jaro1
post Feb 20 2011, 11:05
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Merlin or someone else who knows his command functions 100% properly, please write an EXACT command for losslessly converting file.wav (16/44) to file.wma (16/44) when using normal Windows cmd (not the command related to fb2k, eac, etc...), with your bass related encoder.

Than please, write an EXACT command for the same type of conversion, using fb2k.

I know the instructions in this topic, the problem is, that in foobar the conversion will start when applied the parameters written in this thread, but the conversion is terribly slow (~0.80x realtime), and in Windows cmd the conversion doesn't start at all.

I want only to know, where is the flaw, because i don't think this is a normal behavior (in the case of fb2k, with Windows cmd i'm completelly wrong), thanks.

os: W7 x86
fb2k parameter applied: -silent -input - -output %d -a_codec WMA9LSL -a_mode 2 -a_setting Q100_44_2_16

This post has been edited by jaro1: Feb 20 2011, 11:09
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lvqcl
post Feb 20 2011, 11:40
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Works here:
WMAenc.exe -silent -input test.wav -output test.wma -a_codec WMA9LSL -a_mode 2 -a_setting Q100_44_2_16
Or even:
WMAenc.exe -silent -input - -output test.wma -a_codec WMA9LSL -a_mode 2 -a_setting Q100_44_2_16 < test.wav

Foobar2000:
parameters: -silent -input %s -output %d -a_codec WMA9LSL -a_mode 2 -a_setting Q100_44_2_16
or even: -input %s -output %d -a_codec WMA9LSL -a_setting Q100_44_2
highest BPS mode: 16

("-input -" works too, but foobar2000 reports "Length mismatch" for WMA files coverted this way: e.g. original file has 7479360 samples, WMA file has 7479000 samples)
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jaro1
post Feb 20 2011, 12:41
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In the case of fb2k, nothing has changed, so conversion starts with the rate below 1.0x realtime.
In the case of Windows cmd, it will start but with the same rate as with fb2k. Nobody didn't mention this problem here (maybe WXP), so from my point of view if its all right with my system, bass related encoder is unusable under W7, its strange.
Thanks for your reply and help.

This post has been edited by jaro1: Feb 20 2011, 12:42
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lvqcl
post Feb 20 2011, 13:28
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My OS is Win7 x64. Core2 2500 MHz, ~50 x realtime encoding.

Maybe your HDD is too fragmented?
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jaro1
post Feb 20 2011, 15:50
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So, it seems it could be related to cpu architecture (nothing to do with fragmentation).
My PC: W7 x86, K8 (Athlon 64 3200+, sc. 754)

I've done the testing conversion on one notebook with Core2 mobile (Pentium DC) without the problem.
It will be good if someone else with old K8 could confirm the strange encoding behavior (encoding rate <1.0x realtime) with this bass related cmd wma encoder.
Otherwise its something with my system, but i haven't slightest clue what it should be.

This post has been edited by jaro1: Feb 20 2011, 15:52
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lvqcl
post Feb 20 2011, 16:51
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What is the speed of WAV->FLAC converting?
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Merlin_de
post Feb 20 2011, 17:43
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QUOTE (jaro1 @ Feb 20 2011, 15:50) *
So, it seems it could be related to cpu architecture (nothing to do with fragmentation).
My PC: W7 x86, K8 (Athlon 64 3200+, sc. 754)


hi,
do you work on network path (with wlan) ?
do you has low RAM ?
do you have other prog like virusscanner active for check wav and wma on demand ?

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jaro1
post Feb 20 2011, 19:33
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I don't understand, how is Flac related with bass wma encoder, but the answer is ~55x realtime. I haven't similar problem with other encoders as with standalone usage or with fb2k.
I don't work on network path, have enough RAM (1.5GB), MS Security essentials installed but cpu usage during conversion is almost 100% allocated by WMAenc, antivirus is idle at that moment.
It will be really good to check the case with other K8, because i really don't see any collidating process with the conversion.
Thanks for comments.
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lvqcl
post Aug 30 2011, 21:15
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A small command-line WMA encoder is available here - http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....showtopic=90519
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Nick.C
post Aug 30 2011, 21:47
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Excellent - tried it with my 55 sample test set both losslessly and after processing with lossyWAV (using --codec lossless).

It doesn't work with mono unfortunately.

It does however take advantage of the zeroed LSBs in lossyWAV output, resulting in smaller output files for lossyWAV processed audio (402 kbit/s [-q X] vs 806 kbit/s).

This post has been edited by Nick.C: Aug 30 2011, 21:51


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lossyWAV -q X -a 4 --feedback 4| FLAC -8 ~= 320kbps
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jaro1
post Aug 30 2011, 22:52
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Wow, many thanks, works fine here.

Only short note to Merlins bass-based wma encoder, now i remember, shortly after a discussion stopped in this thread for some time i´ve discovered the problem, with the Process Explorer help. It seemed slow encoding (<1.0x) was in wrong "priority redistributing"(?) of hard-adjusted two encoding threads competing with each other and it is related to all single-core CPUs (regardless of architecture, this problem can be reproduced also with dual-core with setting the WMAenc.exe affinity (e.g. in Taskman) to one core only) i´ve sent him a PM about it, no fix since then. Curious, what is the behavior with more than dual-core CPUs..
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lvqcl
post Aug 31 2011, 15:48
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QUOTE (Nick.C @ Aug 31 2011, 00:47) *
It doesn't work with mono unfortunately.


Yes, WMA lossless supports only stereo and 5.1 files.

In theory, it is possible to add mono -> stereo conversion to the encoder, but now it doesn't perform any conversion itself.
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nbarzgar
post Apr 17 2012, 17:33
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QUOTE (Merlin_de @ Jan 5 2011, 16:39) *
hello,
since win7 MS decide to change from old WM9Encoder (COM based ) to the new Windows Media Encoder IWMEnc Interface.
WME is afaik part of the Windows Media Player. therfor win7 user dont need to install WM9Encoder (dont work anny more).

based on the BASS audio library http://www.un4seen.com/ i made a small console app that convert
*.mp3;*.mp2;*.mp1;*.ogg;*.wav;*.aiff;*wma -> wma.

the command line is the same as used by the known WMCmd.vbs / WME9.vbs
eg.

Encoder: WMAenc.exe
Ext: wma
Parameter: -a_codec WMASTD -a_setting Q50_44_2 -input "-" -output %d

-input "-" = input from STD
-input "%s" = foobar temp file
-input "D:\myFile.mp3" = file

-output %d = output file name (foobar variable)
-output"D:\myFile.mp3" = output file name

-a_setting Q50_44_2 = VBR 50% 44000 kbits 2 channel (use other supportet wma codecs if you want)
-a_setting Q100_44_2 = lossless

you use
.\ WMAenc.exe
.\Bass\bass.dll
.\Bass\basswma.dll

WMAenc.exe work on all win >= win2k
on win2k - xp WM9Encoder.exe codecs from MS must be install onyour system (like for WMCmd.vbs / WME9.vbs)
on win7 only the win7 Windows Media Player must be install.

i am noob in dev plugins for foobar, so i need help from a dev to create a foobar plugin enviroment for the Converter Setup page (like the Flac GUI page). if some dev can help me, i can make a nice GUI Plugin for foobar.

maybe some dev contact me.

DOWNLOAD:
WMAEncoder.zip


Thanks so much, works great here from inside foobar2000 (x86)!! smile.gif
Was searching around for quite a while since the former method stopped working.

I use as parameters (just in case someone was wondering - I liked that setting):
(using the Custom-settings-window in f2k's convert-dialogue)
-silent -a_codec WMA9STD -a_mode 2 -a_setting Q75_44_2 -input %s -output %d

This post has been edited by nbarzgar: Apr 17 2012, 17:36
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