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Do Not Use the Vorbis FFMPEG enecoder if you building WebM!, Monty mentions this in his blog post, but nobody is listening!
HotshotGG
post Jun 12 2010, 18:37
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A lot of open-source enthusiasts and advocates are very excited about Google latest announcement of VP8 / Vorbis combo in a new container called WebM. The entire HTML 5 enthusiasts are so excited that they went a ahead a little to prematurely are building suboptimal builds! Michael Niedermeyer of FFMPEG projects acknowledges that the FFMPEG Vorbis encoder is buggy! Monty has a work around on his blog if you plan on building the WebM encoder under Linux. I am also providing an explanation in the wiki as to why it's generally a good idea to use the mainline libvorbis with libavcodec instead due to the fact that is has 5.1 channel coupling implemented correctly! Please spread the word as this will turn into a disaster sooner or later before it's patched. If you thought the HTML 5 wars are not bad enough now! laugh.gif

Monty's Blog:
http://xiphmont.livejournal.com/51160.html

This post has been edited by HotshotGG: Jun 12 2010, 18:43


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Canar
post Jun 14 2010, 20:16
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Canar reporting in with an ABX. A blind monkey could do it. I see deaf people.

Vorbis via libvorbis v1.3.1 -q1 at ~84kbps vs. FFMPEG v0.5.2 -aq20 at 104kbps. Pink Floyd's Fearless off of Meddle.

FFMPEG sounds like shit, even at the higher bitrate. Pre-echo, warbling... all over the place. Libvorbis sounds significantly more transparent.

Sorry I couldn't bitrate match better, too lazy. FFMPEG still fails it.

Edit: For some perspective, I've played around with more bitrates. Libvorbis at -q0 (65kbps on this sample) has about the same amount of warbling as FFMPEG at -aq30 (136kbps on this sample) and has significantly less pre-echo. Seriously. Monty's not joking around here. FFMPEG is an immature, novel implementation of a Vorbis encoder and it clearly shows. This is not meant to disrespect FFMPEG; such a task is not trivial. However, if transparency matters at all, -q0 beats FFMPEG at half the bitrate and that's no exaggeration. "Unusably bad" is not rhetoric, I think that's an accurate portrayal of the state of FFMPEG's current Vorbis encoder state. It's like old-school Xing vs. LAME.

Edit 2: WHOOPS! I wasn't using libvorbis 1.3.1, I was using aoTuV b5.7. Switching doesn't change the results all that much. -q0 is now a bit less transparent, but FFMPEG still loses out, for the same reasons.

This post has been edited by Canar: Jun 14 2010, 20:42


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Posts in this topic
- HotshotGG   Do Not Use the Vorbis FFMPEG enecoder if you building WebM!   Jun 12 2010, 18:37
- - NullC   TOS #8!!!   Jun 14 2010, 01:13
|- - Zarggg   QUOTE (NullC @ Jun 13 2010, 20:13) TOS #8...   Jun 14 2010, 17:09
|- - NullC   QUOTE (Zarggg @ Jun 14 2010, 09:09) QUOTE...   Jun 14 2010, 17:48
|- - Zarggg   QUOTE (NullC @ Jun 14 2010, 12:48) It...   Jun 15 2010, 05:57
|- - NullC   QUOTE (Zarggg @ Jun 14 2010, 21:57) QUOTE...   Jun 19 2010, 00:39
|- - saratoga   QUOTE (NullC @ Jun 18 2010, 19:39) Many t...   Jun 19 2010, 01:14
|- - NullC   QUOTE (saratoga @ Jun 18 2010, 16:14) QUO...   Jun 19 2010, 03:06
- - Kohlrabi   I don't get the point of this post, ffmpeg-peo...   Jun 14 2010, 08:54
- - saratoga   I don't think you have to validate something t...   Jun 14 2010, 18:39
- - LordWarlock   QUOTE (NullC @ Jun 14 2010, 18:48) It wou...   Jun 14 2010, 18:41
|- - NullC   QUOTE (LordWarlock @ Jun 14 2010, 10:41) ...   Jun 14 2010, 19:21
|- - saratoga   QUOTE (NullC @ Jun 14 2010, 14:21) QUOTE ...   Jun 14 2010, 20:45
- - Canar   Canar reporting in with an ABX. A blind monkey cou...   Jun 14 2010, 20:16
- - lvqcl   What is worse: FFMPEG Vorbis, FFMPEG WMA or FFMPEG...   Jun 14 2010, 20:57
|- - Canar   QUOTE (lvqcl @ Jun 14 2010, 14:57) What i...   Jun 14 2010, 21:11
- - HotshotGG   QUOTE The problem is that people do not realize th...   Jun 15 2010, 05:52
- - dutch109   This problem has already been raised here when the...   Jun 15 2010, 14:23
- - Kohlrabi   You can generate your own citation: Go to #ffmpeg...   Jun 19 2010, 12:09
- - Oded Shimon   A bit late here, for what it's worth, here is ...   Jul 20 2010, 16:03


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