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iso.wv creation with mkisofs, Hot to create iso.wv with mkisofs?
db1989
post Mar 17 2010, 17:24
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Three bags full, sir…

Stating my opinion that ISO is not the best format to spare people the horror of having to extract audio files before using them does not mandate that I suggest or design a better one, but I'll suggest one anyway: the original CD. Over and out.

This post has been edited by dv1989: Mar 17 2010, 17:25
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vasiukoff
post Mar 17 2010, 17:33
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QUOTE (dv1989 @ Mar 17 2010, 19:24) *
Three bags full, sir…

Stating my opinion that ISO is not the best format to spare people the horror of having to extract audio files before using them does not mandate that I suggest or design a better one, but I'll suggest one anyway: the original CD. Over and out.

I agree with you: original CD - the best. But It's offtopic, sir... Please stop to flood...

This post has been edited by vasiukoff: Mar 17 2010, 17:37
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skamp
post Mar 17 2010, 19:01
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QUOTE (vasiukoff @ Mar 17 2010, 16:49) *
Waiting for explanation from you with REAL EXAMPLE.

Matroska is a multimedia container that can mix audio, video, images and other arbitrary types of files.
I know Foobar can play audio matroska files (.mka) and display cover artwork from those. I tried it a few years ago, it worked.


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WonderSlug
post Mar 17 2010, 19:15
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QUOTE (vasiukoff @ Mar 17 2010, 04:26) *
QUOTE (hlloyge @ Mar 17 2010, 15:07) *
It is not ISO image; it is wv + cue + whatever file inside zip file.

Look at this:
file Vladimir_Vysotskiy_-_Luchshee_Tom_1_CD1_\(2008_eac_wv_cue_log_covers_tags\)_by_doremi.iso.wv
Vladimir_Vysotskiy_-_Luchshee_Tom_1_CD1_(2008_eac_wv_cue_log_covers_tags)_by_doremi.iso.wv: ISO 9660 CD-ROM filesystem data '\302\340\350\350 \302\361\366\350 - \313\367\345 \362\354'


It's ISO9660 file - not archive. In fact, it's not an AudioCD (Red Book), it is DATA CD. So, if you burn it, you will get a DATA CD with files (wv + cue + whatever) inside.


In that case, couldn't you just use a program like Nero, to burn all those .wv, .cue, .jpg, etc. files to an ISO image by using the destination as "Image Recorder CD-R/CD-RW" ?

That will create an ISO file with all that inside of it.

Then rename the file to .iso.wv
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Fandango
post Mar 17 2010, 19:48
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I guess multi-session images would be one way of putting the wavpack file at the beginning, i.e. first session.

But I wonder why a player would support such a file if not because of a bug. What if that bug gets fixed? You can't play back those ISO images anymore.
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odyssey
post Mar 17 2010, 22:05
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QUOTE (vasiukoff @ Mar 17 2010, 16:49) *
QUOTE (skamp @ Mar 17 2010, 18:40) *
QUOTE (vasiukoff @ Mar 17 2010, 16:22) *
But If you know how to create the similar using other type of archive (not ISO!) -- I will be glad to know how to do it. Could you explain me how to do it?

Wouldn't Matroska be better suited for that?

Waiting for explanation from you with REAL EXAMPLE.

So, how about iTunes LP? I think the format (or at least the idea of it) is great and similar to what you want to achieve. It is effectively stored in just a .zip archive (renamed) and AFAIR consists of some DHTML to provide navigation. Only downside could be restraints to formats etc, but I have never played with it so I don't know. Eventually when HD-AAC (SLS) comes around it may provide lossless compression out-of-the-box.

Would be nice with a tool to create these LP-files using pre-defined themes or something like that... And a player (foobar2000 especially) that supports it fully (well foobar2000 will at least be able to read the archive no matter what).


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odyssey
post Mar 17 2010, 23:43
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If just the format defined albumcover...


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Fandango
post Mar 17 2010, 23:51
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QUOTE (odyssey @ Mar 17 2010, 22:05) *
So, how about iTunes LP?

It needs a better name. laugh.gif

Besides thread starter already said he wants to know about iso.wv only. Because it seems he wants to upload CD rips with some filesharing program. It seems the only people in the world who would want to listen to such a joke of a "file format" are some filesharers.
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greynol
post Mar 18 2010, 00:02
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...and then we get flooded with posts asking for help with their downloadz.


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vasiukoff
post Mar 18 2010, 08:35
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QUOTE (WonderSlug @ Mar 17 2010, 21:15) *
QUOTE (vasiukoff @ Mar 17 2010, 04:26) *
QUOTE (hlloyge @ Mar 17 2010, 15:07) *
It is not ISO image; it is wv + cue + whatever file inside zip file.

Look at this:
file Vladimir_Vysotskiy_-_Luchshee_Tom_1_CD1_\(2008_eac_wv_cue_log_covers_tags\)_by_doremi.iso.wv
Vladimir_Vysotskiy_-_Luchshee_Tom_1_CD1_(2008_eac_wv_cue_log_covers_tags)_by_doremi.iso.wv: ISO 9660 CD-ROM filesystem data '\302\340\350\350 \302\361\366\350 - \313\367\345 \362\354'


It's ISO9660 file - not archive. In fact, it's not an AudioCD (Red Book), it is DATA CD. So, if you burn it, you will get a DATA CD with files (wv + cue + whatever) inside.


In that case, couldn't you just use a program like Nero, to burn all those .wv, .cue, .jpg, etc. files to an ISO image by using the destination as "Image Recorder CD-R/CD-RW" ?

That will create an ISO file with all that inside of it.

Then rename the file to .iso.wv

Thank you for your answer biggrin.gif
Forgive me for my indiscretion, but I would like to make a remark: I am a certified IT-professional with higher engineering education, but not a beginner. For me not important question of finding a specific program, which I could make such a file. For me, it is important to understand exactly what options should be used in order to get the result. For example, ISO9660 level, Joilet, Rock Ridge, UDF and so on. And it would be nice to know about other similar decisions. And if they exist, I would like to have them complete technical information with real examples, not just an idea. Therefore, if anyone of you really know in detail what he said - please write about it. If there are links to technical documentation - please leads them. Otherwise, it will be just flood. Sorry if someone hurt. I have no purpose to brag, I just want to find the answer to my question.
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vasiukoff
post Mar 18 2010, 08:43
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QUOTE (Fandango @ Mar 17 2010, 21:48) *
I guess multi-session images would be one way of putting the wavpack file at the beginning, i.e. first session.

But I wonder why a player would support such a file if not because of a bug. What if that bug gets fixed? You can't play back those ISO images anymore.

Multisession?
It's really good idea! THANKS! I will try to test it. And I think this feature - it's not a bug. I will also ask developer(s) of foobar2000 about this.
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vasiukoff
post Mar 18 2010, 08:52
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QUOTE (odyssey @ Mar 18 2010, 01:43) *
If just the format defined albumcover...

Do you really try to create this by yourself?
Look at the documentation of format on http://www.apple.com/itunes/lp-and-extras/ . IMHO it's much easy to use iso.wv. biggrin.gif
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vasiukoff
post Mar 18 2010, 10:36
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QUOTE (skamp @ Mar 17 2010, 21:01) *
QUOTE (vasiukoff @ Mar 17 2010, 16:49) *
Waiting for explanation from you with REAL EXAMPLE.

Matroska is a multimedia container that can mix audio, video, images and other arbitrary types of files.
I know Foobar can play audio matroska files (.mka) and display cover artwork from those. I tried it a few years ago, it worked.

I tried to use Matroska and I successfully create an audio with cue. But cover artwork not showed. Could you please explain, how to do it visible?
P.S.: I think, that it will be better than iso.wv if cover artwork will works.
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skamp
post Mar 18 2010, 10:44
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QUOTE (vasiukoff @ Mar 18 2010, 10:36) *
I tried to use Matroska and I successfully create an audio with cue. But cover artwork not showed. Could you please explain, how to do it visible?
P.S.: I think, that it will be better than iso.wv if cover artwork will works.

IIRC, you need the "Album Art Panel for matroska" component.


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vasiukoff
post Mar 18 2010, 11:04
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QUOTE (skamp @ Mar 18 2010, 12:44) *
QUOTE (vasiukoff @ Mar 18 2010, 10:36) *
I tried to use Matroska and I successfully create an audio with cue. But cover artwork not showed. Could you please explain, how to do it visible?
P.S.: I think, that it will be better than iso.wv if cover artwork will works.

IIRC, you need the "Album Art Panel for matroska" component.

I found that in case of foobar2000 v. 1.0.1 mka opens without any problems. If cover art named as cover.jpg(png) - it's showed. If I try to load component Art Panel --> I receive error. May be album art is already supported?
Also several questions:
1. Is it possible to playback this file in other players and OSes? I know, that Mastroska is cross-platform, but Audacious on my Linux desktop does not open it.
2. What about supporting of mka on PDA, MacOS & Linux?
3. Is it possible to view more than one file as cover art? (I mean front, back, disc pictures).

This post has been edited by vasiukoff: Mar 18 2010, 11:05
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vasiukoff
post Mar 19 2010, 11:13
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Dears,

Now I understand how it works (thanks to David ) and want to explain to other people how to use WavPack with file containers or media containers (thanks to Skamp). Probably it will be interesting for all.

QUOTE (Fandango @ Mar 18 2010, 01:51) *
Besides thread starter already said he wants to know about iso.wv only. Because it seems he wants to upload CD rips with some filesharing program. It seems the only people in the world who would want to listen to such a joke of a "file format" are some filesharers.


I'm not agree with Fandango — my goal just make an images of my legal CD's for myself.

I. File containers.

How it works and why it works.


QUOTE (Fandango @ Mar 17 2010, 21:48) *
But I wonder why a player would support such a file if not because of a bug. What if that bug gets fixed? You can't play back those ISO images anymore.


It works because the WavPack decoder library (and command-line program) will skip up to 1 MB of "garbage" looking for a WavPack header before giving up. So, if «garbage» smaller than 1MB and it's data — data of file container — it will works normally and it's not a bug. This allows to use several types of a such containers: ZIP, 7-ZIP (without compression, of course) etc and ISO9660.

Advantage of ZIP, 7-ZIP etc in that you can easily prepare a such image. Just make at the first time archive (for example, with 7-zip) with only WV file and then append to this archive other data — WV file will be in the «head» of archive. After that rename it into .WV and append to this file tags (CUE+Art Cover) with your favorite tag editor (for example, mp3tag and foobar2000).

Advantage of ISO9660 (comparing with ZIP, 7-ZIP etc) in that you can use it also like DATA CD image: you can burn it (as DATA CD), you can play with it using Daemon tools, you can open it by WinRAR, WinZIP, 7-ZIP like ordinary archive. It's just a little bit more possibilities than using ZIP, 7-ZIP etc. Creation algorithm is the same: first time you add WV file and after you append to ISO9660 image other data. Rockridge and Joilet recommended. If you wnat to use mkisofs you must use it with -sort option. So, command like:

mkisofs -sort sort.txt -r -J -o myfile.iso.wv myfolderwithalldata


will works correctly. See man mkisofs for details.

Summary of advantages:
  • You have only one file for all what you want.
  • It will works, if your player is support WavPack with embedded CUE.
  • Even if your player is not support embedded CUE (but support WavPack) you cal listen big «solid» file.
  • It's easy to store it and use it.



Summary of disadvantages:
  • You need to use at least two programs (for packing and tagging).
  • You have to read a lot of flood in this topic (joke!) wink.gif.


II. Media container Matroska.

Martoska is developed especially to store in one file several different files.

How to use

Easiest way on Windows OS - you need to install mkvtoolnix [b] and [b] MkvExtractGUI (see http://www.matroska.org/ ) for pack and unpack matroska audio files (mka). See original Matroska documentation how to do it.
Note: to make a cover of disc just attach image with name cover.(jpg|png).

Summary of advantages:
  • Matroska is specially designed for this purpose. If you don't want to extract data from Matroska audio container - mkvtoolnix — it's the only tool what you need.


Summary of disadvantages:
  • Matroska not so widely supported as «native» WavPack.
  • If you need to extract data — you need a special program for this purpose (mkvextract or MkvExtractGUI).
  • Command line syntax of mkvextract does not have a simple command to extract all data from container — you have to know TID etc (but MkvExtractGUI can).
  • Not all players understand CUE and cover art images correctly in mka files. For example, VLC and Windows Media Players (with DirectShow drivers) don't understand CUE. VLC does not shows cover art. Windows Media Player shows last attached image as cover.


NOTE
Foobar2000 works normally with all of described methods.


Best regards,
Artem.
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