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Is it possible to record audio CD in Dolby Pro Logic ?
-Tiziano-
post Dec 20 2009, 21:31
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Dear all

I would like to know if it's possible to record audio CD's in Dolby Pro Logic ( 5.1 or 7.1 ).
ActuallyI have Nuendo 3.2 and I have to buy an audio board with 8 inputs with microphones, in order to be able to tdo that.

But I ask myself if it will be possible to transfer the tracks into a normal audio CD and if this CD will be decoded by the comemrcial readerds.

Is it a stupid idea or it will be possible ?

Thank you very much
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andy o
post Dec 21 2009, 10:48
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I'm sorry, I don't know how to do it, but I'll just say it's definitely not a stupid idea, and it should be possible. It's just not very popular because of 5.1 discrete digital audio, but that can't be stored on redbook CD or most mp3 players, or even cassette tapes or all other stereo analog devices, which DPLII should. (It should be DPLII, not just DPL, by the way.)
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 21 2009, 10:54
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QUOTE (andy o @ Dec 21 2009, 10:48) *
I'm sorry, I don't know how to do it, but I'll just say it's definitely not a stupid idea, and it should be possible. It's just not very popular because of 5.1 discrete digital audio, but that can't be stored on redbook CD or most mp3 players, or even cassette tapes or all other stereo analog devices, which DPLII should. (It should be DPLII, not just DPL, by the way.)


Ok fantastic, but is it technically possible ? I tell why I have doubts and I would like to clear my confused ideas:

- I don't find any software that creates 5.1 or 7.1 DPL-II from 7 tracks, ready to be masterized in a compatible normal audio CD
- With all the decoders that are in the commerce for each standard, in what manner they can ""undesrtand"" if my CD is Dolby recorded or is normal CD or is a DTS in place od DPL-II ?

I just have confusion and I need really that somebody helps me to clear out those doubts.

The meaning, as I told, is to start to record music ( concerts or special music as new Wave and so on ) in Dolby PL ( just because compatible with the normal audio world and virtually I don't need to masterize it into a DVD but a normal CD-Audio ) .... but due the items listed above, I do'nt know where to start for it ...

Thank you very much :-)
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Akkurat
post Dec 21 2009, 12:15
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Am I missing something here? "Normal audio CD" = red book = 2-channel signed 16-bit PCM sampled at 44,100 Hz. Google & Wikipedia is your friend. smile.gif
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 21 2009, 12:52
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QUOTE (Akkurat @ Dec 21 2009, 12:15) *
Am I missing something here? "Normal audio CD" = red book = 2-channel signed 16-bit PCM sampled at 44,100 Hz. Google & Wikipedia is your friend. smile.gif


Yes Akkurat, but the question is: Dolby Pro Logic II is a matrix ( normally Analog obtained ) of 5 channels in two ... L & R ... it means ( just deducting ) that in L and R channels I have the information about Center, SL and SR ... the LFE is obtained by filtering ... ( today should be even 7.1 if I understood correctly, but i don't know in what manner it is matrixed ).

Is it correct ? ( because if this is wrong, then I'm out of hte road of course )

It means that if I record L & R encoded in Dolby Pro Logic II, I will be able to read it with a normal CD player ( as red book describes ) and if I play it with a decoder Dolby Pro Logic II I will be able to extract the surround information needed ... is it correct ?
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Maggi
post Dec 21 2009, 14:04
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QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 13:52) *
It means that if I record L & R encoded in Dolby Pro Logic II, I will be able to read it with a normal CD player ( as red book describes ) and if I play it with a decoder Dolby Pro Logic II I will be able to extract the surround information needed ... is it correct ?


Yep, that should be working, if you encode your discrete surround channels properly into two channels for making an audio CD.

Still, it won't be true surround as in a discrete 5.1 (6.1 or 7.1) signal, but should be good enough anyways.

Also, depending on the quality of your CD player's analog outputs, you might want to opt for feeding your surround amplifier digitally via S/PDIF or TOS link.

Cheers,
Maggi
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 21 2009, 14:20
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QUOTE (Maggi @ Dec 21 2009, 14:04) *
QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 13:52) *
It means that if I record L & R encoded in Dolby Pro Logic II, I will be able to read it with a normal CD player ( as red book describes ) and if I play it with a decoder Dolby Pro Logic II I will be able to extract the surround information needed ... is it correct ?


Yep, that should be working, if you encode your discrete surround channels properly into two channels for making an audio CD.

Still, it won't be true surround as in a discrete 5.1 (6.1 or 7.1) signal, but should be good enough anyways.

Also, depending on the quality of your CD player's analog outputs, you might want to opt for feeding your surround amplifier digitally via S/PDIF or TOS link.

Cheers,
Maggi


Fantastic. Ok it means that it's compatible with normal Audio CD but the surround information can be detected and reproduced as required.

What plug-in, VST or stand alone software can I use in order to encode 5.1 or 7.1 channels in Pro Logic II please ?
To record tracks I just use Nuendo, but I have not idea on what to use to encode in 5.1 or even better 7.1


P.S. are able, the decoders in commerce, to "understand" in what kind of standar dI recorded the CD ? I mean: do they are able to recognize if I recorded in normal LR audio or Dolby Pro Logic or DTS for instance ?


Thank you very much
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Maggi
post Dec 21 2009, 15:12
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QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 15:20) *
Fantastic. Ok it means that it's compatible with normal Audio CD but the surround information can be detected and reproduced as required.


just to nit-pick ... it's not officially compatible, since there's no way to add a dolby identification flag into an audio cd and hence your decoder will not automatically indicate a dolby pro logic input signal

therefore, you'd need to manually enable Dolby Pro Logic decoding on your amp.


QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 15:20) *
What plug-in, VST or stand alone software can I use in order to encode 5.1 or 7.1 channels in Pro Logic II please ?
To record tracks I just use Nuendo, but I have not idea on what to use to encode in 5.1 or even better 7.1


isn't there an option in Nuendo included to downmix to two channels with Dolby Pro Logic matrixing ?


QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 15:20) *
P.S. are able, the decoders in commerce, to "understand" in what kind of standar dI recorded the CD ? I mean: do they are able to recognize if I recorded in normal LR audio or Dolby Pro Logic or DTS for instance ?


nope, see above ... you'd need to select the decoding scheme manually on your amplifier

in my case, I usually listen to audio CDs in "5 channel stereo", but for some CDs (eg. Yello) I often switch to "Dolby Pro Logic" and it's quite interesting to hear some sounds floating around

QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 15:20) *
Thank you very much


you're welcome ... smile.gif

on another thought, you wrote you'd record in 5.1, so why don't you keep all 6 discrete channels, make an AC3 of it and burn it as audio DVD ?

Cheers,
Maggi
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Maggi
post Dec 21 2009, 15:46
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QUOTE (Maggi @ Dec 21 2009, 16:12) *
QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 15:20) *
What plug-in, VST or stand alone software can I use in order to encode 5.1 or 7.1 channels in Pro Logic II please ?
To record tracks I just use Nuendo, but I have not idea on what to use to encode in 5.1 or even better 7.1


isn't there an option in Nuendo included to downmix to two channels with Dolby Pro Logic matrixing ?


apparently, the option is called "MixConvert" and should be available in Nuendo 3.2

http://www.steinberg.net/index.php?id=431&L=1



http://www.steinbergusers.com/TechDocs/Nue..._MixConvert.pdf

HTH,
Maggi
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Akkurat
post Dec 21 2009, 15:59
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QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 13:52) *
Dolby Pro Logic II is a matrix ( normally Analog obtained ) of 5 channels in two ... L & R ... it means ( just deducting ) that in L and R channels I have the information about Center, SL and SR ... the LFE is obtained by filtering ... ( today should be even 7.1 if I understood correctly, but i don't know in what manner it is matrixed ).

Well, live and learn. The road to awareness is filled with mistakes. HUGE mistakes. biggrin.gif I always thought that it's the amp that does the filtering (I've not studied these things very intensely) from bare L&R data. Dunno where that belief came from.. young movie (VHS back then) enthusiastic testing his first "proper" home theater amp? rolleyes.gif
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 21 2009, 16:02
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QUOTE (Maggi @ Dec 21 2009, 15:12) *
QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 15:20) *
What plug-in, VST or stand alone software can I use in order to encode 5.1 or 7.1 channels in Pro Logic II please ?
To record tracks I just use Nuendo, but I have not idea on what to use to encode in 5.1 or even better 7.1


isn't there an option in Nuendo included to downmix to two channels with Dolby Pro Logic matrixing ?


on another thought, you wrote you'd record in 5.1, so why don't you keep all 6 discrete channels, make an AC3 of it and burn it as audio DVD ?

Cheers,
Maggi


on Nuendo 3.2 there is not possibility to encoding in Dolby Pro Logic or other dolbies I saw ...

Audio DVD you tell ? Well I have always separate tracks ... so in what manner would I create Audio DVD ? With Nero ? Or with what some other software please ?


I really thank you very much because your information/answers are making clear to me, this situation
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Maggi
post Dec 21 2009, 16:14
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QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 21 2009, 17:02) *
on Nuendo 3.2 there is not possibility to encoding in Dolby Pro Logic or other dolbies I saw ...

Audio DVD you tell ? Well I have always separate tracks ... so in what manner would I create Audio DVD ? With Nero ? Or with what some other software please ?


just render your mix out as either one 6 channel PCM WAV (or 8 channel) or save the discrete tracks all as individual PCM WAV files and use http://code.google.com/p/wavtoac3encoder/ to make it an AC3 file

as for authoring it to an audio DVD, I don't know if Nero is up to it or if you'd need a dedicated DVD authoring tool like these: http://dvd-audio.sourceforge.net/
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DVDdoug
post Dec 21 2009, 20:16
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QUOTE
The meaning, as I told, is to start to record music ( concerts or special music as new Wave and so on ) in Dolby PL ( just because compatible with the normal audio world and virtually I don't need to masterize it into a DVD but a normal CD-Audio ) .... but due the items listed above, I don't know where to start for it ...
True. It is compatible with regular stereo, but Pro Logic Surround is tricky and doesn't actually work that well for music. It uses "steering logic" to send the sound to the various speakers. Pro Logic II does work pretty well with "regular stereo" if you set the decoder/receiver to the various "soundfield" (non-movie) modes.

QUOTE
on Nuendo 3.2 there is not possibility to encoding in Dolby Pro Logic or other dolbies I saw ...
You might be right... Steinberg discontinues DTS and Dolby Digital Encoders. SurCode makes a Pro Logic Encoder, but it costs $800 USD!!!!

You can "manually" make a Dolby Surround track by making phase-inverted copies of your tracks. Take look at Dolby Encoding Matrices on Wikipedia.

Just as an experiment, I tried this once using a simplified method as follows:

Center Front Channel = Left & Right Channels Identical & in-phase.
Left Front = Left Channel only (silence in the right channel).
Right Front = Right Channel only (silence in the left channel).
Both Rear Speakers = Left & Right Channels 180 degress out of phase.
Left Rear = Left & Right Channels out-of-phase. Left channel is 60-75% stronger than right.
Right Rear = Left & Right Channels out-of-phase. Right channel is 60-75% stronger than left.
Also, delay the rear-channel signals about 30ms.

This actually worked very well, but you can only "steer" the sound in one direction at once. If you try to steer different instruments/vocals to different speakers at the same time, you will get a mess!


QUOTE
Audio DVD you tell ? Well I have always separate tracks ... so in what manner would I create Audio DVD ? With Nero ? Or with what some other software please ?
Most DVD players cannot play DVD-Audio. So, the usual method is to make a "slideshow" DVD, which is a regular Video-DVD with a with a still image and a Dolby AC3 (or LPCM) audio track. (The still image can be the album cover or an image that just shows the song title, etc.)

I assume you can do this with Nero. I've made a DVD with a slideshow, but it was done with obsolete software (Ulead DVD Workshop). Most DVD authoring programs can do a slideshow. You just need to make sure it can create a 5.1 channel AC3 soundtrack, or that it can use an AC3 track created with WAVtoAC3encoder.











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-Tiziano-
post Dec 22 2009, 11:57
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Ok perfect, a couple of questions again now:

In Wikipedia there is the matrixing of ProLogic IIx 5.1 but not 7.1 .. how can I obtain it ? ( just to follow your idea to make it manually. Indeed yesterday I was thinking to this and suddenly I received your confirmation here ... )
I have to calculate the square root of the half and to apply to the levels of each channel. It's laborious but not impossible ... I ask myself why there is not any software that makes it ...

About DVD-Audio
@Maggi: I tried the sourceforge.net, but even if they talk about graphical interface, once installed I have only text interface ... perhaps the author doesn't realize that the majority of us uses something called GUI ... grrrrrrr I hate text interface ...

@DVDdoug: Good idea about a normal DVD with fixed picture. But with Nero ? In what manner could I make it please ?
When I open Nero, I have "DVD" .. ok .. I selct than a DVD and appears VIDEO_TS and AUDIO_TS folders ... how can I do it then ? Could you suggest me please ?

I want to tell that I'm extremely enthusiastic for the clarifications and the suggestions here received, and I'm really realizing a little project in order to test the situations you depicted and to check them. Of course I will let you know after have succeeded over my "disasters" that I'm doing now smile.gif
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Maggi
post Dec 22 2009, 17:25
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QUOTE (-Tiziano- @ Dec 22 2009, 11:57) *
About DVD-Audio
@Maggi: I tried the sourceforge.net, but even if they talk about graphical interface, once installed I have only text interface ... perhaps the author doesn't realize that the majority of us uses something called GUI ... grrrrrrr I hate text interface ...


I admit, it is not exactly obvious to find:

http://sourceforge.net/projects/dvd-audio/files/
shows all available files

http://sourceforge.net/projects/dvd-audio/...er.exe/download
is the required application

http://sourceforge.net/projects/dvd-audio/...er.exe/download
is the link for the GUI, which requires Qt4.4

http://qt.windows.binaries.googlepages.com/index.html

...

Considering that not many DVD players are actually able to playback audio DVDs (didn't know that one before), your best bet is to make a slideshow DVD, just like DVDdoug suggested.

For that task, you'd need any kind of DVD Authoring program, such as those listed here:
http://www.freeware-base.de/freewares-kategorie607.html

Cheers,
Maggi
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DVDdoug
post Dec 22 2009, 20:34
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QUOTE
In Wikipedia there is the matrixing of ProLogic IIx 5.1 but not 7.1 ..
If I understand it correctly, 7.1 cannot be derived from 2-channel "Dolby Surround". I believe it's an additional 2-channels matrix-encoded into a 5.1 channel digital AC3 recording. And, I don't know of any "home-software" that can do this encoding.

QUOTE
I have to calculate the square root of the half and to apply to the levels of each channel. It's laborious but not impossible ...
No! wink.gif You only need 3 factors... Square root of 1/3 = .577, square root of 1/2 = .707, square root of 2/3 = .817. But, the levels are not that critical... When I did my little experiment, I didn't adjust the levels like that. The phase is critical. Officially, the left channel is supposed to be shifted by +90 degrees, and the right is supposed to be shifted by -90. But, I just inverted the phase of one rear channel to make those two 180 degrees out-of-phase, and then added a delay to "randomize" the phase effects with the front channels. (The delay isn't important if the rear channels are completely different tracks... But, I "derived" my rear channels from a stereo source.)

But again, I don't really recommend matrixed Pro Logic surround for music. True 5.1 channel Dolby AC3 is much better (if DVD format is acceptable).

QUOTE
But with Nero ? In what manner could I make it please ?
When I open Nero, I have "DVD" .. ok .. I selct than a DVD and appears VIDEO_TS and AUDIO_TS folders ...
Sorry, I've never used Nero to author a DVD. Some versions may not be able to author a DVD... I dunno... I think the free version that came with my DVD-burner can copy (non copy-protected) DVDs, but I don't think it can make a DVD...

When you're done, your DVD will have a VIDEO_TS folder which contains the audio & video (or still) multiplexed together into one or more VOB files. The AUDIO_TS folder will be empty. (Take a look at any DVD with Windows Explorer.)

I've used the following DVD authoring programs:
Ulead DVD Workshop (now obsolete)
Corel Movie Factory ($30 USD)
DVD-Lab ($100 - $250 USD)
And, wikipedia has a list of DVD authoring software.

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-Tiziano-
post Dec 22 2009, 23:18
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It's a pity about Dolby Pro Logic IIx for music, because the idea was to produce something compatible with "old stereo" nd at the same time containind new feature, without obliging people to get a DVD in place of a normal CD.

Ok I have to accept that Pro Logic IIx is not to use for this purpose then ... ( ?! ) Anyway I will try also the "manual encoding" as suggested by DVDdoug ... it looks alike interesting thing ... and about the 7.1 form what i understood from wikipedia, it's a new matrix Dolby did ... compatible with "old" stereo and so on .. but I have not clue in what manner they did because it's not written and I didn't find documentation about

Or I have to abbandon the idea of Pro Logic II and "old" Stereo Compatibility and I have also to abbandon DVD Audio because the readers are not so many in the market ...

Everybody here suggested to use normal DVD with fixed picture and to make it as SlideShow. Technically is even better because from what I learned, each channel has its own audio-track.

The only one note is that people, when are buying DVD's, is expecting movies on it too ... it means that buyers are expecting some video clip ... mmmmhhhh if they find just a fixed picture they feel them self jocked I think ... so the purpose to join Music with Dolby should necessary be: Music and Dolby and not pictures ... so or
DVD Audio or "old stereo" with matrix Pro Logic IIx ... this is my partial conclusion after have been reading all the intervention ...
Does anybody agrees with my partial conclusion ? Or I'm wrong ?

But what I did now ?

Well I recorded a .WAV file with Nuendo 3.2 in which are interleaved 8 channels.
Each channel has my voice that tells:

"Channel Right"
"Channel Left"
"Channel Center" and so on just for the first experiment

Files are named:

L
C
R
LFE
SL
SR
RL
RR


and I saved also separate files. One file for each audio-track in order to have them available.

til lhere was easy. Then I used DVD Slide Show and imported the interleaved .WAV file. Results: it plays only the Channel Left. All the rest is like doesn't exists ... so I have to find some another solution with some other program I think.
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DVDdoug
post Dec 23 2009, 01:00
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QUOTE
Well I recorded a .WAV file with Nuendo 3.2 in which are interleaved 8 channels.
Each channel has my voice that tells:

"Channel Right"
"Channel Left"
"Channel Center" and so on just for the first experiment
Good idea! This is going to require some experimenting with different software and there will be a learning-curve. So, it's a good idea to keep things simple 'till you get it all figured-out.

QUOTE
...till here was easy. Then I used DVD Slide Show and imported the interleaved .WAV file. Results: it plays only the Channel Left. All the rest is like doesn't exists ... so I have to find some another solution with some other program I think.
I don't think you'll be able to use more than 6 channels... I don't know where you can find a 7.1 channel encoder....

If DVD Slideshow does not have an AC3 encoder, you'll have to use WAVtoAC3encoder and feed the AC3 file into DVD Slideshow. (I'm not sure if that will work with DVD Slideshow.) Some DVD authoring programs don't have an AC3 encoder, and some only have a 2-channel AC3 encoder. Some might not accept a 5.1 channel AC3 file as input.*


* There are 3 steps in making a DVD (not including editing). This can get tricky because depending on what software you have, you might need to use different programs for each step:

1. Encoding - MPEG-2 video and either uncompressed LPCM (2 channels) or AC3 (1-6 channels) audio.
2. Authoring - Creating menus & creating the VIDEO_TS folder with the VOB, IFO, and BUP files.
3. Burning

For example:
Movie Factory does all 3 steps (and some editing too).
DVD-Lab only does the authoring.

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2E7AH
post Dec 23 2009, 01:14
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I would add idea for fast encoding using foobar:
  • Dolby Headphone wrapper can be feed with 5.1 (either from your source file or by adding channel mixer or free surround or matrix mixer in chain for upmixing before the wrapper) and thus produce nice stereo files with DH effect
  • or use suggested up-mixers for playing with coefficients and producing multichannel files

also there is Dolby Pro Logic II wrapper here, which require PL2XDLL.dll (from Power DVD: "C:\Program Files\QuickTime\PowerDVD8\AudioFilter" for example)

of course I prefer understanding the process as possible before doing it

[edit] added link to pro wrapper

This post has been edited by 2E7AH: Dec 23 2009, 01:58
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 23 2009, 14:22
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Ok, following you suggestions I worked till 3 o'clock by night.

What I ""discovered"" is that: it seems there are not any 7.1 coders ... it's sound strange because if Dolby produces 7.1 and 9.1 decoders and so on, why I cannot find the coders ?
Boh ...

I watched also programs as
Final Cut
Adobe PremiŤre

and so on, without getting something about 7.1 ... it looks alike "the final secret" ... and it must not be so.

The only one "thing" that accepts 7.1 and even more, is Window Media Encoder. There ara instructions on Microsfot Website about: how to do it. Windows Media Encoder and Dolby 7.1, importing an interleaved .WAV file and producing a Dolby 7.1 .WMA file.

What I could listen to is that:

If I play the 7.1 created with Nuendo, it "seems" that it is "Pro Logic IIx" encoded. It's just a sensation, because the amplitudes of ignal and the "phasing", by ear, they are looking alike Pro Logic coded ...

If I play the .WMA obtained with Microsoft Media Encoder, everything has plus or minus the same amplitude. I'm able here to detect phase variations as it happens with .WAV file.

Perhaps I strongly wrong but this is just a sensation I wanted here to expose ( human ears are not measure isntruments and I have not measure isntruments at the moment here :-) )

Anyway, I tried also WAVtoAC3 coders succesfully, but the problem is: when I import a 7.1 coded file into programs I have, they refuse it becasue it's 7.1 and not 5.1 ... this is a mess ... crying.gif

This post has been edited by -Tiziano-: Dec 23 2009, 14:31
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 29 2009, 12:39
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Ok guys, sorry for the absence but I had serious problems with my PC.
I solved them, I made some experiment and I'm here with results ( I made several tests ).

You were to support me, and I think I can give you my feedback because I appreciated your support. I hope what I'm telling is also helping you:

Well I have here a resume of all the experiments I did:


Softwares
With NERO VISION it's possible to create Slides too ( photo album )
With NERO SUOUND TRAX is possible to create Dolby Digital audio tracks till 7.1
With nero is NOT possible at the moment, to create DVD Audio
With WaveLab 5 is possible to create DVD Audio but only Dolby Digital 5.1 not 7.1
With Windows Media Center is possible to code 5.1 and 7.1 in two tracks but this is not Pro Logic at all.
Indeed they are decoded in the following way:

L to L
C to C
R to R
LFE to LFE
BUT
SL to C
SR to C !!!


To have plug ins in order to code in DTS with Nuendo and I think other programs, you need MINNEKOTA Plug Ins the "SurCode - Surround Code - series )
Minnekota Site

No program I found and not any DVD/CD Writers are compatible with SACD technology.

BUT there is also theMP3 solution.
Yes ... Fraunhofer with Thomson has created a 5.1 system for free ( forprivate use is FREE ) in which you can code 5.1.
BUT you can decode it only with their decoder. It's not Dobly Pro Logic, it's not Dolby Digital
Fraunhofer link
It's their own manner to code a 5.1 MP3 into a normal and full compatible MP3.
But the way in which is coded, is similar to a SACD or better: 2 layers. The similarities are finished here :-))

A layer with 2.0 ( Stereo )
A layer with the rest of the channels ( C, SR, SL, MFE )

But you need to have all their stuff
Moreover they have a "stuff" also that convert into 5.1 each normal stereo audio program. Sincerely I'm not interested to those faking things ... or surround is TRUE or should be something else but I don't admit any strange manipulation ... So I will NEVER EVER suggest their program for such things ...


On the market:

What I saw is:
SACD sold in US in 2008 about 1.5 Millions
DVD Audio sold in US 2008 about 1.7 Millions
CD Audio sold in US 2008 about 470 Millions

It means clearly: the new technology is NOT PUSHED.
it's extremely valid technology ( also SACD because compatible with the "old world" ) but industry seems do not have interest to push it forward.

CD-A Market is extremely strong and MP3 you now well: is downloadable from iTune, Amazon and so on with minimum expense
it means that if this normal Stereo Program is coded in Pro Logic II it will be very nice to listen to it ... I mean: REAL one ... not fake one ...

But: where to find a program that code 5.1 into Pro Logic II and IIx ???

I have not clue sad.gif



Hardware Market

I went in huge Hi-Fi and so on shops during this week ... I visited a lot of those shops ... and what I noticed clearly is:

Dolby Digital is everywhere
With Blue Ray everything is 5.1 ... about 7.1 I didn't saw it's shadow ... so forget it ... at he moment I mean ... no device were implementing 7.1
Dolby ThrueHD just two devices (up more than 12 shops !!! )
Dolby Pro Logic: only Radio receivers ( they decode nothing because no Radio stations here in EU, apart little exceptions, are using Dolby! ) but they have CD readers ... normal stereo that passes through Pro Logic Decoder ...
I have not clue if the other devices with Dolby Digital had Pro Logic ... because it was not written ...

So, in my understanding, after having seen all those things, the only TWO ways to produce Dolby Programs are:
DVD/Slide Show in Dolby Digital
CD-A in Pro Logic ( where is a software that codes 5.1 or 7.1 in Pro Logic ? )

What do you think about ?

Thank you very much
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 29 2009, 14:11
Post #22





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From: BelgiŽ
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URGENT UPDATE

I found the software for Dolby Pro Logic II !!!! IT'S FREE
Free Encoder or Dolby Pro Logic II
it doesn't do the 7.1 at the moment.

how to do ? Well: you have to produce an AC3 or multiplexed .WAV File then you use this Encoder/Decoder .. it creates a .MP3 file

Well ... now get it and import it in NERO to create a normal audio CD.

Reading this CD with a Dolby Pro Logic II system, it assigns correctly the channels. Do it please wink.gif
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 30 2009, 11:37
Post #23





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Sorry I tried to edit my previous message but it was not possible.

I would like just to give you the .mp3 PRO LOGIC II coded. Please try you too to get it, to burn a normal audio CD ( CD-A ) and to listen to it with a decoder Pro Logic II. All channels should be at their place.

I tell you in what manenr I did it.

I - with Nuendo I creadted a 48kHz 16bits interleaved .WAV file with 6 tracks
II - Using WAVtoAC3Encoder that's free in internet, I created the AC3 file using the settings you can download here ( the extension is: .presets ).
III - with Aud-X I imported the AC3 File, I choosen 192kHz quality ( because the only one in which is written compatible with Pro Logic II ) and I encoded the file you can download here.

I hope you appreciate it

I have to thank you everybody for the clarification and the helps that broguht me finally to produce what I needed.
Of course I'm concerned to go at 7.1 ... this is my goal ... but at least I can start in Surround.

Thank you really very much to everybody and I'm sorry if I annoyed you.
Till soon
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Toad S
post Dec 31 2009, 06:52
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I know what your going though. I was hunting for a week or two and was ready to give up. All I wanted to do was to convert my DTS music into a file that would play off of my USB flash drive in my Dolby ProLogic2 car stereo. The files could be WMA, Mp3 or AAC but only 2 channel. So I could ether find a prologic2 encoder or for get it. I found two free ones that work great. They both have to be used with the program Foobar2000. This program is fantastic! If your not familiar with what it can do I'll tell you. It can play and convert a lot of different audio formats. I can now go staight from multichannel (5.1) wav's, DTS or AC3 to a Dolby Prologic2 encoded (2.0) mp3, AAC or WMA compressed audio file. Boy do they sound great in my car! Here's the info on the two foobar2000 componets.

1) AndrewLabs ATSurround for foobar2000 (foo_dsp_atsurround) AndrewLabs home page The Prologic2 encoder works for free but the decoder has noise like waves until you purchase. $14.95

2) Pro_Optimizer made a great "free" ProLogic2 encoder called "foo_dsp_downmix" I like it the best because it has more control options to adjust the sound if needed. It's listed in this forum. foo_dsp_downmix - Hydrogenaudio Forums

You can't go wrong with ether one. they both make a nice Dolby Prologic II encoded Stereo file.
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-Tiziano-
post Dec 31 2009, 10:24
Post #25





Group: Members
Posts: 23
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From: BelgiŽ
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QUOTE (Toad S @ Dec 31 2009, 06:52) *
I know what your going though. I was hunting for a week or two and was ready to give up. All I wanted to do was to convert my DTS music into a file that would play off of my USB flash drive in my Dolby ProLogic2 car stereo. The files could be WMA, Mp3 or AAC but only 2 channel. So I could ether find a prologic2 encoder or for get it. I found two free ones that work great. They both have to be used with the program Foobar2000. This program is fantastic! If your not familiar with what it can do I'll tell you. It can play and convert a lot of different audio formats. I can now go staight from multichannel (5.1) wav's, DTS or AC3 to a Dolby Prologic2 encoded (2.0) mp3, AAC or WMA compressed audio file. Boy do they sound great in my car! Here's the info on the two foobar2000 componets.

1) AndrewLabs ATSurround for foobar2000 (foo_dsp_atsurround) AndrewLabs home page The Prologic2 encoder works for free but the decoder has noise like waves until you purchase. $14.95

2) Pro_Optimizer made a great "free" ProLogic2 encoder called "foo_dsp_downmix" I like it the best because it has more control options to adjust the sound if needed. It's listed in this forum. foo_dsp_downmix - Hydrogenaudio Forums

You can't go wrong with ether one. they both make a nice Dolby Prologic II encoded Stereo file.


Hi Toad S' I was thinking that Foobar2000 was a simple ( and sophisticated ) player only. It's good that it is matrixing in encoding phase too.
Anyway I will check it.


With the system I suggested on my last message, Conversion works fine, as you can see downloading and using the .mp3 file I realized.
The onlyone thing tha I lost is the LFE ( is recorded in a separate track as usual ), but the WAVtoAC3 converter has a lot of settings without explanations, so that I simply tried one of them. I think it's just question of settings.

Indeed I could also load each single track ( L, C, R, SL, SR, LFE ) in "mux" window and it makes is own job. I have to try many possibilities but anyway: it works fine.

About Foobar I will download it in few minutes adn I will install it. I will use the free library you suggested. I hope to find all the necessary documentation about conversion and I hope that there will be not any "line command" but only GUI to use ...

I will let you know if I will be successful smile.gif

Thank you very much smile.gif
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