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[seemingly abandonware] iPod manager, also known as foo_dop
2Pacalypse
post Jun 14 2006, 22:17
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firstly this is a great plugin!

can you sent playlists to ipods via this plugin. I tried sending them (right clicking on a playlist and selecting send to ipod) all the songs were transfered to my ipod but the playlist wasnt.

im using the 0.2.1 and a 4g ipod
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furious
post Jun 14 2006, 22:26
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to my knowlegde this feature is in the works.
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mobyduck
post Jun 15 2006, 14:52
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Jun 13 2006, 07:18) *
QUOTE (mobyduck @ Jun 13 2006, 15:52) *
Thanks for your time, musicmusic.

I have an "old" 20Gb click-wheel iPod and I'm currently using foo_pod (no iTunes, thanks). I'd like to test your plug-in but, before I do, I have a couple of questions, if you don't mind. smile.gif

1. 99% of the work I need to do with my iPod is synching: I have a single PL in foobar that is "replicated" on the iPod and when I change it in foobar (adding, updating or removing songs) I simply "sync" it with foo_pod. Is this feature already implemented or are you planning to develop it in the future?

2. As I use foo_pod, I have not upgraded the firmware to the latest release: will this be a problem with foo_dop?

I look forward to trying your new toy!

Alessandro

1. Sync is my main target to implement smile.gif Its not implemented yet, but what I planned was sync with foobar2000's music library + selected playlists. I guess probably I could make the media library bit optional as well then.
2. It must be newer than the latest 3G firmware I think so I doubt it smile.gif But generally I think later firmware is prefered (out of interest, what problem does that create with foo_pod?)
IIRC, there were some incompatibility issues between newer firmware versions and iTunesDB format (written by foo_pod). But don't quote me on that. wink.gif

If synching the media library means "send everything from any foobar playlist" then I'd definitely like it to be optional.

Anyway, thanks for your attention.

Cheers.

Alessandro

[Edit]Does foo_dop require the iPod Service?

This post has been edited by mobyduck: Jun 15 2006, 15:11
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toology
post Jun 15 2006, 17:13
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Yes, AFAIK it requiers iPod Service to be installed.
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mobyduck
post Jun 16 2006, 08:41
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QUOTE (toology @ Jun 15 2006, 08:13) *
Yes, AFAIK it requiers iPod Service to be installed.
Well, I hope musicmusic will find a way to remove this restriction. wink.gif

Alessandro
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david_dl
post Jun 16 2006, 09:01
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QUOTE (toology @ Jun 16 2006, 05:13) *
Yes, AFAIK it requiers iPod Service to be installed.


No it doesn't. That's only for the mount/unmount commands.
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musicmusic
post Jun 16 2006, 20:05
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0.2.6 released, details in changelog (its mostly clean-up).


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furious
post Jun 18 2006, 07:01
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this plugin is amazing

thank you so much musicmusic

two questions

i was looking at the "to do" list- i know that full syncronization is the ultimate goal- but what about being able to send specific playlists to the iPod?

can this write a DB from scratch or does it depend on the presence of an itunesDB already?

just curious

thanks for the GREAT work!

This post has been edited by furious: Jun 18 2006, 07:19
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Scidd0w
post Jun 18 2006, 11:46
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Just want to say thank you for this great component musicmusic.
Been waiting for it after foo_pod died a bit.. smile.gif
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TrNSZ
post Jun 19 2006, 16:48
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I just wanted to let you know that I used this to populate a new 5G iPod and it seems to work very well.

Thanks.
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djkc
post Jun 19 2006, 17:56
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First, thank you very much for this, great to have an iPod plugin for 0.9.

Have a 20gb 4g iPod with click wheel, noticed just a few bugs so far:

1. Tried the rebuild database function, it completed (foo_pod always crashed foobar when I tried doing that with it) and was mostly accurate. One song ended up with missing tags (had been transcoded from ape to mp3 by foo_pod if I remember right) but no other songs were messed up. My On The Go playlist became a regular one (same always happened with foo_pod) and the songs were messed up in it. Previously had several albums of songs by 2 artists in it, after the rebuild had a few songs each by a dozen or two artists, mostly (or possibly completely, can't remember 100%) tracks added to the iPod at the same time as the tracks that were in that playlist before.

2. I have three smart playlists for stuff added in the last 1 day, 1 week, and 1 month. Hadn't added anything to my iPod in a couple weeks so only the 1 month playlist had any content. Transferred about a dozen albums to it on Saturday with 0.2.7, but not all as one batch, mostly groups of 1 or 2 albums at a time as I was browsing my recent stuff playlist in foo. Once I finished I disconnected my ipod and found that only the last album that was transferred showed up in the 1 day and 1 week playlists. 1 month one had that same album plus the stuff loaded a couple weeks ago that was there before. None of the other stuff transferred with foo_dop though.

If you want copies of my ipodDB before+after I can send later when I'm at home, but right now just have ipod and no cable.

On the good side though:
- Some Korean albums by 이정현 had previously had their tags messed up in the database by some problem between iTunes, Anapod, and foo_pod, the rebuild fixed that finally.
- Had no language problems at all. The files that were already on there had tags in English, Spanish (accented characters and the upside down punctuation marks), Korean, Japanese, and Chinese. All showed up fine after the rebuild. One of the albums transferred was tagged in Thai (I use pubble's thai edition of the ipod firmware that adds thai display support on my ipod) and that has no problems either.

And for wishlist, I'll join others in hoping you can get around to adding transcoding, have a lot of ape or flac + cuesheet rips. foo_pod never handled them very well and itunes doesn't at all. It gets to be a pain to remember what's in what and transcode in advanced before transferring, especially since you have to rescan for replaygain. Keeping dupes of it all pre-transcoded on hard drive is confusing, plus even more space per album...
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Demonanya
post Jun 19 2006, 18:13
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I've noticed something very strange whilst listening to my iPod and wonder if anyone is seeing the same thing. I updated to the latest version of foo_dop last night and repopulated my iPod (5G btw) so basically started from afresh. On my journey to work this morning I was flicking through the various songs and for some reason, rather than playing a new song from the start it would begin playing it from where the last song left off i.e. I listened to a song until 1:50 and then skipped, the next song would start at 1:50 and not from the beginning.

Hope that makes sense as it beats the hell out of me why it's doing it smile.gif Apart from that everything else is working spot on and I'm loving it smile.gif
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musicmusic
post Jun 19 2006, 18:48
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[quote name='furious' post='404066' date='Jun 18 2006, 07:01']
this plugin is amazing

thank you so much musicmusic

two questions

i was looking at the "to do" list- i know that full syncronization is the ultimate goal- but what about being able to send specific playlists to the iPod?[/quote]I think I will add that. My only concern for playlist sending was the method of identifying which songs are already on the iPod (but files not identical) since you don't want to end up with duplicates if you've modified the files locally or something. But I think I will just go with metadata comparison for that (ARTIST, TITLE and ALBUM fields).

[quote name='furious' post='404066' date='Jun 18 2006, 07:01']
can this write a DB from scratch or does it depend on the presence of an itunesDB already?

just curious[/quote]Needs valid iTunesDB present currently.

[quote name='furious' post='404066' date='Jun 18 2006, 07:01']
thanks for the GREAT work!
[/quote]Thanks wink.gif

[quote name='Scidd0w' post='404119' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:46']
Just want to say thank you for this great component musicmusic.
Been waiting for it after foo_pod died a bit.. smile.gif
[/quote]Your welcome wink.gif

[quote name='TrNSZ' post='404493' date='Jun 19 2006, 16:48']
I just wanted to let you know that I used this to populate a new 5G iPod and it seems to work very well.

Thanks.
[/quote]Thanks for testing smile.gif




[quote name='djkc' post='404513' date='Jun 19 2006, 17:56']
First, thank you very much for this, great to have an iPod plugin for 0.9.

Have a 20gb 4g iPod with click wheel, noticed just a few bugs so far:

1. Tried the rebuild database function, it completed (foo_pod always crashed foobar when I tried doing that with it) and was mostly accurate. One song ended up with missing tags (had been transcoded from ape to mp3 by foo_pod if I remember right) but no other songs were messed up.[/quote]That file probably had no tags. I guess foo_pod's author thought like kode54.

[quote name='djkc' post='404513' date='Jun 19 2006, 17:56']
My On The Go playlist became a regular one (same always happened with foo_pod)[/quote]Indeed, intended. I recall iTunes doing the same.

[quote name='djkc' post='404513' date='Jun 19 2006, 17:56']
and the songs were messed up in it. Previously had several albums of songs by 2 artists in it, after the rebuild had a few songs each by a dozen or two artists, mostly (or possibly completely, can't remember 100%) tracks added to the iPod at the same time as the tracks that were in that playlist before.[/quote]Not too sure why they ended up with wrong tracks, unless you started using foo_dop before version 0.2.5. Is that the case?

[quote name='djkc' post='404513' date='Jun 19 2006, 17:56']
2. I have three smart playlists for stuff added in the last 1 day, 1 week, and 1 month. Hadn't added anything to my iPod in a couple weeks so only the 1 month playlist had any content. Transferred about a dozen albums to it on Saturday with 0.2.7, but not all as one batch, mostly groups of 1 or 2 albums at a time as I was browsing my recent stuff playlist in foo. Once I finished I disconnected my ipod and found that only the last album that was transferred showed up in the 1 day and 1 week playlists. 1 month one had that same album plus the stuff loaded a couple weeks ago that was there before. None of the other stuff transferred with foo_dop though.[/quote]Strange, not sure about that one. Well I have an idea, can you check where the last modified date/time is for those files you added locally on your computer? If it is that the album that showed up is in the last day/whatever and the others are before one month then it somewhat makes sense as to the cause.

[quote name='djkc' post='404513' date='Jun 19 2006, 17:56']
If you want copies of my ipodDB before+after I can send later when I'm at home, but right now just have ipod and no cable.[/quote]Yeah, I think I'd like to look at them, even if the answer to both questions above is yes. Thanks.

[quote name='djkc' post='404513' date='Jun 19 2006, 17:56']
And for wishlist, I'll join others in hoping you can get around to adding transcoding, have a lot of ape or flac + cuesheet rips. foo_pod never handled them very well and itunes doesn't at all. It gets to be a pain to remember what's in what and transcode in advanced before transferring, especially since you have to rescan for replaygain. Keeping dupes of it all pre-transcoded on hard drive is confusing, plus even more space per album...
[/quote]Transcoding: No converter API as far as I have seen. Even then, its not too high on my priorities (it can be worked around, other things less so)
Chapters: Still haven't seen an example of proper chapter data in the iPod's database and so I don't know what the iPod does with it or even if its any use at all. If not I can look into some other solution to get it working.


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musicmusic
post Jun 19 2006, 19:45
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QUOTE (Demonanya @ Jun 19 2006, 18:13) *
I've noticed something very strange whilst listening to my iPod and wonder if anyone is seeing the same thing. I updated to the latest version of foo_dop last night and repopulated my iPod (5G btw) so basically started from afresh. On my journey to work this morning I was flicking through the various songs and for some reason, rather than playing a new song from the start it would begin playing it from where the last song left off i.e. I listened to a song until 1:50 and then skipped, the next song would start at 1:50 and not from the beginning.

Hope that makes sense as it beats the hell out of me why it's doing it smile.gif Apart from that everything else is working spot on and I'm loving it smile.gif


Hmm blink.gif

I think maybe its related to the "Remember playback position" flag on each track in the database. I was setting it but the only 5G database I've seen doesn't seem to have it set on its songs. I've changed it so that the next version doesn't set it for new songs sent by foo_dop.

Not sure why it ended up with behaviour you saw though.


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furious
post Jun 19 2006, 19:52
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one thing that has happened twice- at least to me. (most likely a fluke)

when the on-the-go playlist is changed to a regular playlist (i did not load the library or rewrite the DB- i simply plugged in the ipod and sent a new song)...let me start from the begining.

all the music on my ipod is form itunes. i load up foo_dop and send one track to the ipod (no problems- i love it) i then add an album to the OTG playlist. then add the one new song.

when i plug in the ipod to send another song to the ipod (no loading of the library and no rewriting of the library- just one song sent to the ipod) the OTG list becomes a regular playlist (as it should) but the last track the one that i added with foo_dop has changed to a different song. no trouble with any music- it's just a different song- in fact it changes to the same song both times i recreated the "problem".

is the meta data crossing? should i rewrite the DB?

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musicmusic
post Jun 19 2006, 20:05
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Its not metadata crossing but looks like wrong track being written to the playlist after converting it OTG -> Normal playlist. I doubt rewrite DB will do anything useful.

Someone complained of same above. I'll try your steps myself and see if I can reproduce it.

Otherwise iTunesDB + OTGPlaylistInfo* backups at each step would be nice but I'll try repro it before I ask for those.


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jarsonic
post Jun 19 2006, 20:10
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QUOTE
Chapters: Still haven't seen an example of proper chapter data in the iPod's database and so I don't know what the iPod does with it or even if its any use at all. If not I can look into some other solution to get it working.


http://www.pastecultureclub.com/

The Paste Culture Club podcast has integrated chapters. Maybe you can toss it on your iPod and take a look at the database data it generates?
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djkc
post Jun 19 2006, 22:08
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QUOTE
That file probably had no tags. I guess foo_pod's author thought like kode54.
No, I have a number of other files sent with it via transcoding, just that one was goofed up. Suspect it was just a fluke, file probably got messed up at some point. Possibly it was why trying a rebuild always crashed foo_pod.

QUOTE
Not too sure why they ended up with wrong tracks, unless you started using foo_dop before version 0.2.5. Is that the case?
No, 0.2.7 was the first version I ever installed and tried.

QUOTE
Strange, not sure about that one. Well I have an idea, can you check where the last modified date/time is for those files you added locally on your computer? If it is that the album that showed up is in the last day/whatever and the others are before one month then it somewhat makes sense as to the cause.
Nope. They were almost all ripped within the last week. The ones from the last batch added that actually show up were the only older ones:
Created Tuesday, March 16, 2004
Modified Saturday, June 17, 2006
(I changed the genre tag before sending)

However now that I looked through the artists list on my ipod more heavily, I don't think the other ones that were added last time are showing up anywhere. I'll do another DB rebuild when I get home and see if I'm right, pretty sure I added some stuff that doesn't appear to be there at all.

Also found that I have a duplicate artist with the same exact albums listed under both copies of it after the DB rebuild. Think it might be case related. The list goes:
けちゃっぷMania
けちゃっぷmania
けちゃっぷMania

Middle one I screwed up at one point and used fullwidth ascii instead of regular ascii while tagging one of their songs, so it should be seperate and only has the one track under it. After previewing this I see the board automatically converts fullwidth ascii to regular in posts, so the list looks confusing - middle one should be %EF%BD%8D %EF%BD%81 %EF%BD%8E %EF%BD%89 %EF%BD%81 for the "mania" part, not regular ascii. The first and third entries are identical in display and in albums listed under them. Band's name should be just けちゃっぷmania and I know I had an album or two accidently tagged as けちゃっぷMania with a capital M in the past, they're corrected now on my hard drive but I don't think they are on the iPod. I'm guessing the rebuild combined the lowercase and capital versions like it should, but then entered it under both the lower case and upper case spots.

QUOTE
Yeah, I think I'd like to look at them, even if the answer to both questions above is yes. Thanks.

Alright, can do in about 2 hours.

QUOTE
Transcoding: No converter API as far as I have seen. Even then, its not too high on my priorities (it can be worked around, other things less so)
Chapters: Still haven't seen an example of proper chapter data in the iPod's database and so I don't know what the iPod does with it or even if its any use at all. If not I can look into some other solution to get it working.

I wasn't even thinking chapters, actually. The normal converter splits tracks into seperate mp3s when you use it on a lossless+cue rip unless you tell it specifically to put it all in one file. And I realize it's low priority since everyone can seperate their lossless stuff, do the usual right click->convert, then readd them, replaygain scan, and then send to ipod with the rest of their stuff. Just nice when you don't have to think about that and can just select all->send to ipod. Just felt I should mention it so you know how many people are looking for that feature.
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musicmusic
post Jun 19 2006, 22:32
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Jun 19 2006, 20:05) *
Its not metadata crossing but looks like wrong track being written to the playlist after converting it OTG -> Normal playlist. I doubt rewrite DB will do anything useful.

Someone complained of same above. I'll try your steps myself and see if I can reproduce it.

Otherwise iTunesDB + OTGPlaylistInfo* backups at each step would be nice but I'll try repro it before I ask for those.
So far I didn't have any problems. If you can repro it and could make those backups that would be great. Otherwise I'll keep an eye out for this.

QUOTE (jarsonic @ Jun 19 2006, 20:10) *
QUOTE

Chapters: Still haven't seen an example of proper chapter data in the iPod's database and so I don't know what the iPod does with it or even if its any use at all. If not I can look into some other solution to get it working.


http://www.pastecultureclub.com/

The Paste Culture Club podcast has integrated chapters. Maybe you can toss it on your iPod and take a look at the database data it generates?
Thanks, I tried that. Well my 3G iPod did nothing at all with the chapter data.

I think maybe best way to handle it is going to be to add the entries to the DB separately and use the start/stop time fields.

QUOTE (djkc @ Jun 19 2006, 22:08) *
QUOTE
Strange, not sure about that one. Well I have an idea, can you check where the last modified date/time is for those files you added locally on your computer? If it is that the album that showed up is in the last day/whatever and the others are before one month then it somewhat makes sense as to the cause.
Nope. They were almost all ripped within the last week. The ones from the last batch added that actually show up were the only older ones:
Created Tuesday, March 16, 2004
Modified Saturday, June 17, 2006
(I changed the genre tag before sending)
Right, but by your example the ones that showed up in the last day/week smart playlist had the modified date as within the last day (on Sat). I'll look at the DB it should give me somes answers.

[Edit] Yes, I found the cause of the bug. It should be fixed in next version.

QUOTE (djkc @ Jun 19 2006, 22:08) *
However now that I looked through the artists list on my ipod more heavily, I don't think the other ones that were added last time are showing up anywhere. I'll do another DB rebuild when I get home and see if I'm right, pretty sure I added some stuff that doesn't appear to be there at all.

Also found that I have a duplicate artist with the same exact albums listed under both copies of it after the DB rebuild. Think it might be case related. The list goes:
けちゃっぷMania
けちゃっぷmania
けちゃっぷMania

Middle one I screwed up at one point and used fullwidth ascii instead of regular ascii while tagging one of their songs, so it should be seperate and only has the one track under it. After previewing this I see the board automatically converts fullwidth ascii to regular in posts, so the list looks confusing - middle one should be %EF%BD%8D %EF%BD%81 %EF%BD%8E %EF%BD%89 %EF%BD%81 for the "mania" part, not regular ascii. The first and third entries are identical in display and in albums listed under them. Band's name should be just けちゃっぷmania and I know I had an album or two accidently tagged as けちゃっぷMania with a capital M in the past, they're corrected now on my hard drive but I don't think they are on the iPod. I'm guessing the rebuild combined the lowercase and capital versions like it should, but then entered it under both the lower case and upper case spots.

Well, I'll look at your DB as to what exactly the latter is about.

For the former I think the songs should be there someplace, especially if they are listed elsewhere in the iPod? You could load the DB into foobar, sort it by Artist, and that should give you some indication where foo_dop would have put it in the Artist list.

BTW, in case you thought otherwise, rewrite DB does not scan the iPod for files (like foo_pod's rebuild DB does?), it only uses whatever was in the DB already. Or maybe you meant you were going to try with foo_pod, dunno..

This post has been edited by musicmusic: Jun 20 2006, 00:13


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djkc
post Jun 20 2006, 00:51
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QUOTE
Well, I'll look at your DB as to what exactly the latter is about.

For the former I think the songs should be there someplace, especially if they are listed elsewhere in the iPod? You could load the DB into foobar, sort it by Artist, and that should give you some indication where foo_dop would have put it in the Artist list.

BTW, in case you thought otherwise, rewrite DB does not scan the iPod for files (like foo_pod's rebuild DB does?), it only uses whatever was in the DB already. Or maybe you meant you were going to try with foo_pod, dunno..

Latter - have some databases: http://www.filepulse.org/files/313/temp/ipod.rar

Edit: should mention, did another DB rebuild like I said, still duped up.

Former - I'm starting to doubt my own sanity now, the files are simply not there at all. Checked one I know I transfered, it's not on the iPod. Checked total files from a dir /s in the music directory on it versus number of songs listed when I load the media library with foo_dop, they match. Sorry for wasting your time... Only guess I have is that after transferring them they were selected in the playlist and I did something stupid like deleting them while cleaning some other older stuff off it without realizing they were selected too.

And yes, I didn't realize it only checked the existing files, foo_pod's rebuild scans the whole drive if I remember right and will add files outside the usual ipod file structure. Good to know the difference.

One more feature request that I forgot to make in my first post: "Check free space" in the iPod menu. Always convenient to have that within the app rather than having to check it in explorer or finding out when you're low by getting a disk full message.

This post has been edited by djkc: Jun 20 2006, 00:52
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musicmusic
post Jun 20 2006, 01:28
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Thanks, I have an idea what the problem is: the sort I use isn't case sensitive but the iPod is. Basically, I write a list of the songs sorted by Artist to the iPod but the artists of those songs end up in this order:

けちゃっぷMania
けちゃっぷMania
けちゃっぷMania
けちゃっぷMania
けちゃっぷmania
けちゃっぷmania
けちゃっぷmania
けちゃっぷMania
けちゃっぷMania

And that confuses the iPod. I'll check if this is correct tomorrow smile.gif


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musicmusic
post Jun 20 2006, 09:37
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Ok well basically one of your files has a wierd ARTIST field.

In a hex editor it looks like this:
CODE
0000d168h: 51 30 61 30 83 30 63 30 77 30 4D FF 41 FF 4E FF; Q0a0ƒ0c0w0MAN
0000d178h: 49 FF 41 FF                                ; IA

Its the one that sticks out on your iPod ("Welcome To Paradise").

The problem is that the iPod considers that different from the other tracks by the same artist but foo_dop doesn't.

You can fix it in the DB at the same offset by changing those FF bytes to 00. Or better would be retag the file with a proper Artist field (copy it from one of the other files) and rewrite the DB.

I think it can be fixed on my side, so that that track stays a separate entry in the Artist list but the others don't double up, I'll look into it.

This post has been edited by musicmusic: Jun 20 2006, 09:40


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djkc
post Jun 20 2006, 12:20
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Jun 20 2006, 02:37) *
Ok well basically one of your files has a wierd ARTIST field.

In a hex editor it looks like this:
CODE
0000d168h: 51 30 61 30 83 30 63 30 77 30 4D FF 41 FF 4E FF; Q0a0ƒ0c0w0MAN
0000d178h: 49 FF 41 FF                            ; IA

Its the one that sticks out on your iPod ("Welcome To Paradise").

The problem is that the iPod considers that different from the other tracks by the same artist but foo_dop doesn't.

You can fix it in the DB at the same offset by changing those FF bytes to 00. Or better would be retag the file with a proper Artist field (copy it from one of the other files) and rewrite the DB.

I think it can be fixed on my side, so that that track stays a separate entry in the Artist list but the others don't double up, I'll look into it.

That's the accidental fullwidth ascii one I mentioned. Changing it to halfwidth ascii and doing a DB rebuild did fix it, thanks.

But if foo_dop considers fullwidth and halfwidth characters the same that's going to cause problems with Japanese stuff like that semi-often. It's rather easy to forget what input mode you're in when typing in mixed kana/kanji + ascii names and ending up with the ascii parts in fullwidth by accident. Sort by unicode codepoint after the initial sort might take care of it... Most apps I've seen treat them as the same if compared to other characters, but different if compared to each other. カ follows カ before キ does and Q (fullwidth) is after Q but before R. http://www.unicode.org/charts/PDF/UFF00.pdf is the doc on them if that helps, just the FF00-FFFF range needs special consideration...
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musicmusic
post Jun 20 2006, 13:11
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Well it considers them different, excepting when it comes to sorting (I guess this is what you were talking about):

If I sort by artist only, it will differentiate the double-width one and put it after the sindle-width ones.
If I sort by artist following some other varying data, the comparison func will treat the double width and single width ones the same and sort by the varying data afterwards.

You can see the same in foobar by loading your library, and seeing the difference when you sort by:
"%artist%"
or "%artist%|%album%|%discnumber%|$num(%tracknumber%,2)|%title%".

So it treats them different, but the same at the same time rolleyes.gif

I wrote a fix anyway, just testing it now.

This post has been edited by musicmusic: Jun 20 2006, 13:25


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djkc
post Jun 21 2006, 00:54
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QUOTE
You can see the same in foobar by loading your library, and seeing the difference when you sort by:
"%artist%"
or "%artist%|%album%|%discnumber%|$num(%tracknumber%,2)|%title%".

o.O Interesting weirdness, I see what you mean. Never noticed it before since I generally don't sort my playlists in foobar. Thanks for your time on getting this straightened out, really appreciate it since I can't honestly say it'll come up for many users.
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