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EAC secure mode, error correction
navin
post Jun 24 2005, 08:29
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I am using EAC to create a CDImage.wack.wav file (wack then uses lame and wavpack to give me my lossy and lossless copies).

Quite a few of my CDs (1 / 10) give read and sync errors in secure mode but rip fine in fast mode (I assume this has no error correction).

The CDs howeer seem to have no scratches or visible physical defects.

In drive options I have accurate stream turned on and C2 turned off and error correction was set to low (medium took so long that the speed crashed to 0.1X).

any suggestions?

how does one determine if a disk will give errors when there are no physical defects visible?

This post has been edited by navin: Jun 24 2005, 09:14
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sh1leshk4
post Jun 24 2005, 09:17
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Is the CD copy-protected?
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navin
post Jun 24 2005, 09:24
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QUOTE (sh1leshk4 @ Jun 24 2005, 01:47 PM)
Is the CD copy-protected?
*

I dont think so. ALl my CDs were purchased before 1993. I am not how to tell if a CD is copy protected though.

If it was copy prootected why would the fast mode work? Would not copy protection disable all modes?

This post has been edited by navin: Jun 24 2005, 09:25
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sh1leshk4
post Jun 24 2005, 10:03
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Is the resulting rip from fast mode has no audible errors?
If there's no error then that's probably the best mode to rip that CD.
Not all CD can be smoothly ripped on secure mode, but cmiiw.
(but that doesn't mean secure mode won't work on that CD...)

This post has been edited by sh1leshk4: Jun 24 2005, 10:13
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navin
post Jun 24 2005, 10:39
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QUOTE (sh1leshk4 @ Jun 24 2005, 02:33 PM)
Is the resulting rip from fast mode has no audible errors?
If there's no error then that's probably the best mode to rip that CD.
Not all CD can be smoothly ripped on secure mode, but cmiiw.
(but that doesn't mean secure mode won't work on that CD...)
*

not only does fast mode have no audible errors but also when i play back the section that secure mode claims to have errors (using "possible errors" in the errror log) i cant hear any errors.

now the questions i am asking is

how does one tell if a CD will hiccup in secure mode. it takes too much time to rip a CD is scure mode only to re do the process in fast mode when secure mode fails.

and why does a CD fail in secure mode?
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westgroveg
post Jun 24 2005, 10:47
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Try test & copy (F6) with fast or burst mode.

This might help you uncover if the source can't be read without errors or your drive is having some conflicts with EAC.
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navin
post Jun 24 2005, 11:00
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QUOTE (westgroveg @ Jun 24 2005, 03:17 PM)
Try test & copy (F6) with fast or burst mode.

This might help you uncover if the source can't be read without errors or your drive is having some conflicts with EAC.
*

thanks.
tried that too. it did throw up CRC errors on 2-3 tracks. but the tracks did not have any audible errors nor does teh CD have any visible defects.
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westgroveg
post Jun 24 2005, 12:02
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QUOTE (navin @ Jun 24 2005, 10:00 PM)
QUOTE (westgroveg @ Jun 24 2005, 03:17 PM)
Try test & copy (F6) with fast or burst mode.

This might help you uncover if the source can't be read without errors or your drive is having some conflicts with EAC.
*

thanks.
tried that too. it did throw up CRC errors on 2-3 tracks. but the tracks did not have any audible errors nor does teh CD have any visible defects.
*


That means there are binary errors. Sometimes CD's degrade without any physical damage like most data storage devices do.

If the errors aren't audible it might not be a problem to you.

If it is you could try to get your hands on a Plextor drive & try recovering the errors using PlexTools Pro's algorithms which are very effective in my experience with minor errors.
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Martin H
post Jun 25 2005, 04:43
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navin - Fast mode is burst mode with sector synchronization, so if your drive has 'Accurate Stream', then use burst mode instead... -Martin.
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navin
post Jun 25 2005, 05:58
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QUOTE (Martin H @ Jun 25 2005, 09:13 AM)
navin - Fast mode is burst mode with sector synchronization, so if your drive has 'Accurate Stream', then use burst mode instead... -Martin.
*


when i test the drive it says it has C2 but when I Examine C2 feature it says that the drive does not have C2.

if CD's degarede over time you mean to say that these binary errrors will eventually get worse and make the CD unplayable on a CD player? That really means that the $15 we pay for the CD we are not buying music but really renting it albeit for about 10 years or more.

So far I have recorded 4 CDs in fast mode and neither of them has any audible errors. Does this mean that I should record all my CDs in fast mode? Maybe Secure mode is correcting for errors that are not nessacarily audible or that my Sony DVD writer does not mate well with EAC and EAC is having trouble with it on some CDs.

I wanted plextor (becasue of all the good reviews here) but i live in India and my computer supplier had not even heard of plextor. does plextor make a DVD writer that can be used "securly" with EAC?

Also I'd like to rip at sppeds exceeding 4x as I got over 600CDs to do. What is the best way to do this with minimal errors. I can ask my hardware guy for a new DVD writer. My dektop form factor is so small that it can take only one drive and 2 hard drives (after sacrificing the floppy drive). The 2 hard drives are a 250GB and a 400GB.

Thanks everyone.

This post has been edited by navin: Jun 25 2005, 06:07
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westgroveg
post Jun 25 2005, 06:28
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QUOTE
if CD's degarede over time you mean to say that these binary errrors will eventually get worse and make the CD unplayable on a CD player? That really means that the $15 we pay for the CD we are not buying music but really renting it albeit for about 10 years or more.

All data storage devices degrade over time CD, DVD, tape, HDD, everything. I don't think there exists a device that retains data until the end of time.

You should backup as most people do on a regularly basis to prevent data loss.

I would try to borrow a Plextor drive if it's just for recovering a few CD's. Plextor drives are really over priced & PlexTools lacks many practical features EAC has that make ripping faster & easier so it's not really worth spending your money IMO.

I started a PlexTools guide if you follow the steps in the Advanced DAE section you will have the best chance of recovering the data.

This post has been edited by westgroveg: Jun 25 2005, 06:34
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navin
post Jun 25 2005, 06:47
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ok after ripping a CD in fast mode (that refused to rip in secure mode) i decided to check out the errors. so under status and error messages i clikced on possible errors. when i try to play any of the the suspicious positions/range I get a n error that says "Wave Audio MCI error".

what does this mean?

This post has been edited by navin: Jun 25 2005, 06:48
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Martin H
post Jun 25 2005, 08:06
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QUOTE (navin @ Jun 25 2005, 06:58 AM)
So far I have recorded 4 CDs in fast mode and neither of them has any audible errors. Does this mean that I should record all my CDs in fast mode? Maybe Secure mode is correcting for errors that are not nessacarily audible...

EAC has 2 non-secure modes... Burst mode is for drives that have accurate stream, and fast mode is for drives that dosenīt have accurate stream... I can see from your first post that you have an accurate stream drive, and therefore if you dont wanīt to use secure mode(or burst test & copy) then i would recommend you to use burst mode instead of fast mode, because it will be faster, and you dont need the additional sector synchronization... When you get errors in secure mode, then try to clean the cd, and then rip it again, and sometimes the errorīs go away...Also itīs not always that the errors is audible... -Martin.
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evereux
post Jun 25 2005, 09:39
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Whilst reading the disc in burst mode you can (with some supported drives) slow down the read speed. Slowling down the read speed has helped me achieve matching CRCs in the past.


--------------------
daefeatures.co.uk
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navin
post Jun 25 2005, 11:18
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QUOTE (evereux @ Jun 25 2005, 02:09 PM)
Whilst reading the disc in burst mode you can (with some supported drives) slow down the read speed. Slowling down the read speed has helped me achieve matching CRCs in the past.
*

hoe does one do this. i already went to drive option/offset speed/ and check of "allow speed reduction". is there a way one can control the exact speed. 1x, 2x, 4x, etc. of the drive?
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evereux
post Jun 25 2005, 13:15
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Immediately above the box you tick for allow speed reduction during extraction is a speed selection box with a pulldown menu. If EAC supports this feature for your drive you can select a read speed other than Actual.


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navin
post Jun 26 2005, 19:54
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QUOTE (evereux @ Jun 25 2005, 05:45 PM)
Immediately above the box you tick for allow speed reduction during extraction is a speed selection box with a pulldown menu. If EAC supports this feature for your drive you can select a read speed other than Actual.
*

what speed would you recommend? 2x, 4x, faster or slower? also with fast mode working well with the 4 CDs that gave trouble is secure mode would oyu say secure mode is overkill. if the 4 CDs that failed in secure mode worked in fast mode wont the CDs that do not give errors rip error free in fast/burst mode?

This post has been edited by navin: Jun 26 2005, 19:58
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