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[seemingly abandonware] Columns UI, alternative user interface
Squeller
post Sep 8 2008, 08:46
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Please lets keep this thread tech only!

Musicmusic, could you please make it possible to have the backgroud colour of the Tab Stack row user definable? Currently it seems to use the Windows "3d objects" colour, which does very likely not go well with the toolbar etc. colours, at least on Vista Aero (where a lot is blueish).



This post has been edited by Squeller: Sep 8 2008, 08:48
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musicmusic
post Sep 8 2008, 13:06
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QUOTE (Canar @ Sep 8 2008, 00:50) *
Way to take a quote out-of-context. The rest of the quote is:
That is just reasoning and encouragement, not so much context, the first two sentences are as definitive as can be. You need to read it from a user's perspective.

QUOTE (Canar @ Sep 8 2008, 00:50) *
Mind pointing out where exactly I'm "complaining"? I'm explaining the reality of the situation.
Sorry, I overuse that word. I was just pointing out the conflict between "we are not rejecting support for xxx component users" and "#foobar2000 is also not a 3rd party component support channel." I'm not doubting you, I am just saying they should be more consistent, if only to avoid the perception you disagree with. You don't seem to see this conflict, so consider some alternatives for that section of the quoted post:

Good:
"In most cases, you will get a better response to questions about third party components on the forums, as most people in #foobar2000 are not familiar with most of them."

Better:
"We welcome discussion about third party components, but be aware you will often get a better response to questions about third party components on the forums, as there may not be users of that component online."

Different tone, not as definitive and more in agreement with you. wink.gif

QUOTE (Squeller @ Sep 8 2008, 08:46) *
Musicmusic, could you please make it possible to have the backgroud colour of the Tab Stack row user definable?
I don't think it is possible, but I will check.

This post has been edited by musicmusic: Sep 8 2008, 13:08


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Canar
post Sep 8 2008, 15:42
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Well, we could debate the point back and forth. I think that the old wording was very direct and told you the relevant information without sugar-coating it. Then it went on to explain itself afterward.

Anyhow, because I trust your judgment more than mine and there was conflict regarding it, I've reworded the few sentences that were "problematic', using your suggestions as a framework. As one of our distinguished third-party component developers, I'd gladly believe that you've got a better handle on how third-party-focused users perceive that paragraph than I do.

I'm an IRC user, so I'm intimately familiar with how that channel works. To me, the old phrasing was exactly true, though perhaps the tone could be misconstrued to mean things that the words did not say.


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2E7AH
post Sep 8 2008, 23:31
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NG PLaylist request: folding

is it possible to implement group folding?
like when you left click group header and you select group contents, maybe when you middle or ctrl click to fold/unfold the group (optionally)
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Keikonium
post Sep 9 2008, 01:21
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QUOTE (2E7AH @ Sep 8 2008, 16:31) *
NG PLaylist request: folding

is it possible to implement group folding?
like when you left click group header and you select group contents, maybe when you middle or ctrl click to fold/unfold the group (optionally)


Seconding this. I think this would be really nice, kind of like EL Playlist smile.gif.


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odyssey
post Sep 9 2008, 08:42
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QUOTE (Keikonium @ Sep 9 2008, 02:21) *
QUOTE (2E7AH @ Sep 8 2008, 16:31) *

NG PLaylist request: folding

is it possible to implement group folding?
like when you left click group header and you select group contents, maybe when you middle or ctrl click to fold/unfold the group (optionally)


Seconding this. I think this would be really nice, kind of like EL Playlist smile.gif.

Just like Outlook? Nice idea. Maybe a "collapse all" would benefit too smile.gif


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TomBarlow
post Sep 9 2008, 11:04
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I believe this is on the feature request list, as collapsible groups. I like it in ELPL, if you had a more album list style collapsing in NGPL I might even use it, it would take up so much less space. (What I mean is, clicking artist group header would show album group headers, then clicking album group headers shows tracks, rather than clicking artist header opens all album groups so you can see tracks...)
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imiganai
post Sep 9 2008, 12:39
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QUOTE (imiganai @ Jan 4 2008, 13:55) *
Hmm. Can anyone else reproduce this? Create a simple layout with a vertical split containing an autohiding toolbar (can be menu, buttons, whatever) and one of the two standard playlist views (hide captions for both).
Then mouse over the toolbar to make it show, and while it's showing, drag the minimize, maximize, or close buttons downward. As in, click and hold on them and move the mouse down.
Does your mouse freeze up like mine does (until you alt+tab or hit the windows key or do anything to remove focus from the window)?

Weird. o_O
So I'd just like to point out that I still have this problem.
If anyone wants to reproduce, here's my super-awesome-crazy-simple layout.
Import it, Mouse over the border between the title bar and the play buttons (the menu bar should appear), then while the menu bar is visible try to minimize the foobar window. Easiest way to escape the freeze is hitting the windows button... huh.gif
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odyssey
post Sep 10 2008, 08:03
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Sep 5 2008, 01:04) *
QUOTE (odyssey @ Sep 3 2008, 09:59) *
musicmusic: How far is the (old) request to put images into tracklist? Say, ratingstars or a moodbar... wink.gif
My main concern was for a ratings column, my thoughts were some dedicated/special columns with an API would be a better idea, with regards to reacting with mouse actions and other things.

This sounds extremely cool! I hope you'll consider starting to implement this feature soon smile.gif


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musicmusic
post Sep 11 2008, 23:50
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Columns UI 0.3.4.2 released. Just a few small additions to the artwork view panel, see changelog for details.

QUOTE (2E7AH @ Sep 8 2008, 23:31) *
NG PLaylist request: folding

is it possible to implement group folding?
like when you left click group header and you select group contents, maybe when you middle or ctrl click to fold/unfold the group (optionally)
Since I made some changes a while ago, I don't think it would be too much work to implement the backend side of this. But on the frontend, it would really need some expand/collapse buttons. Ctrl-click is already used for selections, middle click seems a bit arbitrary - that should probably do what is set in prefs for items anyway.

QUOTE (imiganai @ Sep 9 2008, 12:39) *
So I'd just like to point out that I still have this problem.
If anyone wants to reproduce, here's my super-awesome-crazy-simple layout.
Import it, Mouse over the border between the title bar and the play buttons (the menu bar should appear), then while the menu bar is visible try to minimize the foobar window. Easiest way to escape the freeze is hitting the windows button... huh.gif
I did try, but I couldn't reproduce it on Vista x86 SP1. It doesn't sound like an error on my part, what OS are you using?


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imiganai
post Sep 11 2008, 23:53
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Sep 11 2008, 14:50) *
I did try, but I couldn't reproduce it on Vista x86 SP1. It doesn't sound like an error on my part, what OS are you using?
Hmm. Plain 32-bit XP Professional. I'm not using any window extensions like windowblinds or anything...
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musicmusic
post Sep 12 2008, 00:22
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Yes I was thinking some obscure bug in your OS. If you can, check on a Vista SP1 machine.


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Slotos
post Sep 12 2008, 00:44
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Sep 12 2008, 01:50) *
But on the frontend, it would really need some expand/collapse buttons. Ctrl-click is already used for selections, middle click seems a bit arbitrary - that should probably do what is set in prefs for items anyway.

Doubleclick? It has no effect for group header currently.


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2E7AH
post Sep 12 2008, 02:29
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i was thinking as a part of actions for middle click (to be optional), but double click sounds better.

also when you play the playlist with folded groups, the tracks which are folded i suppose that they won't be played?
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imiganai
post Sep 12 2008, 08:16
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Sep 11 2008, 15:22) *
Yes I was thinking some obscure bug in your OS. If you can, check on a Vista SP1 machine.
Unfortunately I don't have access to a vista box, and it sounds like it may be an XP thing if not my computer being weird. Just to note: this has been a problem in both SP2 and SP3.

Maybe it would be more helpful if someone with an XP box see if they can reproduce it?
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odyssey
post Sep 12 2008, 08:48
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Sep 12 2008, 00:50) *
Columns UI 0.3.4.2 released. Just a few small additions to the artwork view panel, see changelog for details.

QUOTE (2E7AH @ Sep 8 2008, 23:31) *
NG PLaylist request: folding

is it possible to implement group folding?
like when you left click group header and you select group contents, maybe when you middle or ctrl click to fold/unfold the group (optionally)
Since I made some changes a while ago, I don't think it would be too much work to implement the backend side of this. But on the frontend, it would really need some expand/collapse buttons. Ctrl-click is already used for selections, middle click seems a bit arbitrary - that should probably do what is set in prefs for items anyway.

I think a rightclick with both options to collapse/expand and a customizable collapse/expand click on the headers.

Maybe also consider configuring which playlists that should default to "all collapsed" smile.gif


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musicmusic
post Sep 12 2008, 15:24
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QUOTE (Slotos @ Sep 12 2008, 00:44) *
Doubleclick? It has no effect for group header currently.
Unfortunately double click would trigger the single click action which I don't think you would want here.

QUOTE (imiganai @ Sep 12 2008, 08:16) *
Unfortunately I don't have access to a vista box, and it sounds like it may be an XP thing if not my computer being weird. Just to note: this has been a problem in both SP2 and SP3.

Maybe it would be more helpful if someone with an XP box see if they can reproduce it?
I have checked XP x64 and I can reproduce it there. So unfortunately your options are to wait for the menu to hide before clicking minimise or upgrade to Vista.

QUOTE (odyssey @ Sep 12 2008, 08:48) *
I think a rightclick with both options to collapse/expand and a customizable collapse/expand click on the headers.

Maybe also consider configuring which playlists that should default to "all collapsed" smile.gif
Hmm yes those are other ways it could be done smile.gif


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PredUK
post Sep 12 2008, 15:26
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Sep 1 2008, 14:29) *
QUOTE (PredUK @ Sep 1 2008, 13:28) *
$replace(%path%,%filename_ext%,)
You don't need this. Not sure what the backslash is for.
I did this because my music is contained in 2 slightly differenty locations, so that defines the path. I didn't know I didn't need that.
QUOTE
QUOTE (PredUK @ Sep 1 2008, 13:28) *
$if3(album_art,Folder,folder,front,Front,cover)
This won't work. You can only specify one of those, and not in an $if statement. However the built-in foobar2000 reader will pick up most of those. This may help somewhat.
My artwork is always in the folder of the album. No separate folders for multiple discs. The art will either be "album_art" (preferred, from Discogs), or "folder"/"cover", or failing that, if possible I'd like to use a * for anything that's not there. That's why I tried the $if3.
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imiganai
post Sep 12 2008, 15:40
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Sep 12 2008, 06:24) *
I have checked XP x64 and I can reproduce it there. So unfortunately your options are to wait for the menu to hide before clicking minimise or upgrade to Vista.
Am I the only one still using XP? I feel like upgrading to vista would cause many, many more problems than it would fix tongue.gif
I guess it's not possible to create a workaround for XP users? I don't know if you can capture NC_MOUSEDOWN events under the foobar2000 api/agreement but if you can, you could immediately hide auto-hide stuff...
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Squeller
post Sep 12 2008, 17:24
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Hi Musicmusic,

in NG playlist grouping row, it would be very helpful if you'd introduce separate fields for a) group ordering and b) group header display.

Thanks for current development...!
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Slotos
post Sep 12 2008, 18:30
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Sep 12 2008, 17:24) *
Unfortunately double click would trigger the single click action which I don't think you would want here.

Make it optional? =)
Actually I can't imagine situation in which it will annoy me. If I fold it I don't care for invisible group selection. If I unfold, I'll have to click track I want to play/enqueue anyway. And middle clicking on selection doesn't enqueue all selection (just tried), so it really doesn't matter for me. I don't see actions one may do after unfolding that will produce unexpected results if group is selected.

Ok, maybe selecting some tracks, remembering that one needs to visually check it against folded group, unfolding, checking and commencing whatever action using keyboard combination. But this is quite rare and those who will be annoyed will propose some solutions but not until they can actually try and decide if they need it.


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TomBarlow
post Sep 12 2008, 20:44
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It could mess up playback order if "playback follows cursor" is enabled and you can't see which items are selected because they're hidden.

Personally I think it would be best if it was single click on group header to expand/collapse, middle click to select all, or better if it was customizable so you could select which action is performed based on where you click (group header or item) and what button.

Oh and even better, have playlists as a top most "group", you'd have a playlist header, and clicking it would "expand" that playlist. It'd be awesomely compact. Obviously you could only have one playlist expanded at once, it'd still be awesome though...
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Hamallainen
post Sep 13 2008, 11:43
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QUOTE (imiganai @ Sep 9 2008, 13:39) *
QUOTE (imiganai @ Jan 4 2008, 13:55) *
Hmm. Can anyone else reproduce this? Create a simple layout with a vertical split containing an autohiding toolbar (can be menu, buttons, whatever) and one of the two standard playlist views (hide captions for both).
Then mouse over the toolbar to make it show, and while it's showing, drag the minimize, maximize, or close buttons downward. As in, click and hold on them and move the mouse down.
Does your mouse freeze up like mine does (until you alt+tab or hit the windows key or do anything to remove focus from the window)?

Weird. o_O
So I'd just like to point out that I still have this problem.
If anyone wants to reproduce, here's my super-awesome-crazy-simple layout.
Import it, Mouse over the border between the title bar and the play buttons (the menu bar should appear), then while the menu bar is visible try to minimize the foobar window. Easiest way to escape the freeze is hitting the windows button... huh.gif

I use XP SP3 and i tried your layout.
First i had to set a custom hide delay of 1000ms to try to reproduce your problem because before, as soon as my mouse was leaving the menu area, it was instantly autohiding, before i can click the minimize buton.
Now with this delay, when i click the minimize buton and and try to drag, the mouse cursor does move slowly until i release the click but i do not have a complete freeze.
Well anyway if you have set a custom hide delay higher than 0 ms you could try to set back to 0 ms, so that way the menu would hide before you can reach the minimize buton
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imiganai
post Sep 13 2008, 14:07
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QUOTE (Hamallainen @ Sep 13 2008, 02:43) *
Well anyway if you have set a custom hide delay higher than 0 ms you could try to set back to 0 ms, so that way the menu would hide before you can reach the minimize button
That's a really good point and a great workaround. I'm not sure why I had the delay at 1000 anyway; the point of the auto-hide is that I rarely need the menus, and accidentally making it show up was kind of annoying. I completely passed over that option though laugh.gif
Thanks again!
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greenfoot
post Sep 14 2008, 00:59
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Two interface requests:

1. Vertical lines at the end of each column like those in windows explorer.

2. Alternating colors in the playlist view that extend beyond the list index (i.e. all the way to the bottom regardless of the amount of tracks in any given playlist).
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