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Open Source Firmware For iRiver players, development by Rockbox team starts
unfortunateson
post Jul 29 2005, 16:38
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http://wiki.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?ti...less_comparison

Is it premature to inquire about updating the Hardware Support for Wavpack?
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rjamorim
post Jul 29 2005, 16:48
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QUOTE (unfortunateson @ Jul 29 2005, 12:38 PM)
Is it premature to inquire about updating the Hardware Support for Wavpack?
*


I was planning to wait until the RockBox guys deem the iRiver port stable.

As you can see here, they still consider it "partial".

But if people consider updating WavPack hardware status to "green" is warranted, no problem as far as I am concerned.


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dobz
post Jul 29 2005, 18:51
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QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 29 2005, 07:48 AM)
QUOTE (unfortunateson @ Jul 29 2005, 12:38 PM)
Is it premature to inquire about updating the Hardware Support for Wavpack?
*


I was planning to wait until the RockBox guys deem the iRiver port stable.

As you can see here, they still consider it "partial".

But if people consider updating WavPack hardware status to "green" is warranted, no problem as far as I am concerned.
*



The iriver rockbox port is indeed partialy complete, but also note that theres many pages in the documentation that are out of date due to the fast development of rockbox.

IMO hardware support for wavpack is more than justified simply because it works in rockbox and works damn well.

Rockbox was the first to implement hardware support
Gapless playback works
Seeking works
APEv2 tags work
Replaygain works

some crappy software players cant even do this yet.

Update the charts wink.gif even if it just says ROCKBOX.
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jcoalson
post Jul 29 2005, 18:51
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it's probably more useful to have that row be a range the same way 'software support' is

Josh
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rjamorim
post Jul 29 2005, 19:01
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QUOTE (dobz @ Jul 29 2005, 02:51 PM)
The iriver rockbox port is indeed partialy complete, but also note that theres many pages in the documentation that are out of date due to the fast development of rockbox.

IMO hardware support for wavpack is more than justified simply because it works in rockbox and works damn well.

Rockbox was the first to implement hardware support
Gapless playback works
Seeking works
APEv2 tags work
Replaygain works

some crappy software players cant even do this yet.

Update the charts wink.gif even if it just says ROCKBOX.
*


So be it then! WavPack is now the only format all-green, and with an empty "cons" section. Cheers!

QUOTE (jcoalson @ Jul 29 2005, 02:51 PM)
it's probably more useful to have that row be a range the same way 'software support' is

Josh
*


Hohoho. It was a range once. I ditched it for a boolean because we started bitching about ALAC status, and I figured a simple yes/no would be the best compromise. I don't plan to go back now.

This post has been edited by rjamorim: Jul 29 2005, 19:09


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jcoalson
post Jul 29 2005, 20:54
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QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 29 2005, 01:01 PM)
QUOTE (jcoalson @ Jul 29 2005, 02:51 PM)
it's probably more useful to have that row be a range the same way 'software support' is

Josh
*


Hohoho. It was a range once. I ditched it for a boolean because we started bitching about ALAC status, and I figured a simple yes/no would be the best compromise. I don't plan to go back now.


the problem wasn't it being a range, the problem was the metric it was based on. ALAC and FLAC both said 'good' even though ALAC is supported on only one device. but right above it in the software row ALAC said 'bad' because it is supported in only one program.

you argued ALAC h/w support was 'good' because ipod is the #1 portable h/w device. but itunes penetration must be >= ipod penetration because you need itunes to use ipod.

I only argue that the table should be self-consistent in its metrics. and the most natural metric for h/w support is # of supporting devices, the same way that the current metric for s/w is # of supporting programs, because it is an indication of the degree of choice a user will have.

Josh
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seanyseansean
post Jul 29 2005, 21:05
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QUOTE (DreamTactix291 @ Jul 29 2005, 06:20 AM)
QUOTE (Rockbox CVS)
Added comments, Replay Gain, and resume/bookmarks for FLAC.
So now mp3 with ID3v2, Vorbis, FLAC, and WavPack all support ReplayGain. I assume once they get Musepack decoding realtime it will as well.
*



Gaaaaaah, does anyone know when/if musepack is feasible and whether it's actively being developed? I need a rockbox enabled dap or ipodlinux with musepack support then i'll buy *two*, one for me and one for a friend. My windows smartphone with betaplayer is excellent, but only having a 512mb card limits me somewhat and i'm not even going to bother transcoding.
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ilikedirtthe2nd
post Jul 29 2005, 21:11
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QUOTE
Gaaaaaah, does anyone know when/if musepack is feasible and whether it's actively being developed? I need a rockbox enabled dap or ipodlinux with musepack support then i'll buy *two*, one for me and one for a friend. My windows smartphone with betaplayer is excellent, but only having a 512mb card limits me somewhat and i'm not even going to bother transcoding.
*


A Rockbox dev stated somewhere (don't remember - might have been iriver.us or something) that porting Musepack to the IHP isn't trivial and requires a bigger amount of work than the other codecs because of the way the decoder lib is written (uses some 64 bit operations that are terribly slow on the IHP, don't slap me for being very unexact here).

Bottomline: noone is working on Musepack on the IHP right now.

Regards; ilikedirt
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rjamorim
post Jul 29 2005, 21:17
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QUOTE (jcoalson @ Jul 29 2005, 04:54 PM)
you argued ALAC h/w support was 'good' because ipod is the #1 portable h/w device.  but itunes penetration must be >= ipod penetration because you need itunes to use ipod.


First, you don't need iTunes to use iPod.

Second, the software player market is way bigger than the hardware player market. 1 million units of hardware players shipped is an extremely respectable number. 1 million downloads of a software player is tits.


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rjamorim
post Jul 29 2005, 21:22
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QUOTE (ilikedirtthe2nd @ Jul 29 2005, 05:11 PM)
Bottomline: noone is working on Musepack on the IHP right now.


Right. The devs seem to be more interested in consolidating support to Vorbis and MP3 currently (with lots of help towards WavPack consolidation from David Bryant). Also, none of them seems to care about a format they don't use.

I wonder why the Musepack pushers don't contact the people that offered to help with the Neuros port and ask them to help on RockBox. Specially considering how Neuros stuff seems to be surrounded by vapour and megalomania these days.

This post has been edited by rjamorim: Jul 29 2005, 21:23


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seanyseansean
post Jul 29 2005, 21:24
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QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 29 2005, 09:22 PM)
QUOTE (ilikedirtthe2nd @ Jul 29 2005, 05:11 PM)
Bottomline: noone is working on Musepack on the IHP right now.


Right. The devs seem to be more interested in consolidating support to Vorbis and MP3 currently (with lots of help towards WavPack consolidation from David Bryant). Also, none of them seems to care about a format they don't use.

I wonder why the Musepack pushers don't contact the people that offered to help with the Neuros port and ask them to help on RockBox. Specially considering how Neuros stuff seems to be surrounded by vapour and megalomania these days.
*



Why be so abrasive? My original question wasn't pushing anything, I simply wanted to know if the chances of *my* format of choice being supported were any good. ILikeDirt answered my question without fuss, so why the superfluous rhetoric?
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rjamorim
post Jul 29 2005, 21:28
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QUOTE (seanyseansean @ Jul 29 2005, 05:24 PM)
Why be so abrasive? My original question wasn't pushing anything, I simply wanted to know if the chances of *my* format of choice being supported were any good. ILikeDirt answered my question without fuss, so why the superfluous rhetoric?
*


Erm, dude, I'm not calling you a Musepack pusher. I'm talking about the guys running Musepack.net and that came up with that call for developers.

Take a chill pill.


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jcoalson
post Jul 30 2005, 01:18
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QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 29 2005, 03:17 PM)
QUOTE (jcoalson @ Jul 29 2005, 04:54 PM)
you argued ALAC h/w support was 'good' because ipod is the #1 portable h/w device.  but itunes penetration must be >= ipod penetration because you need itunes to use ipod.


First, you don't need iTunes to use iPod.

Second, the software player market is way bigger than the hardware player market. 1 million units of hardware players shipped is an extremely respectable number. 1 million downloads of a software player is tits.

even assuming those numbers are correct... so you're saying the metric is based on a percentage of users that already own a piece of h/w or s/w? again to me this seems obviously irrelevant to an objective measure of "support", buy then why is wmal just "good"? as a percentage of seats wmp blows away everything else away and that's not the only s/w it plays in.

well, maybe the two of us will never agree that if a person is trying to evaluate a codec, he cares about the choice he'll have in using it, and nobody else has piped in on the matter, so I guess we'll just leave it at that.

Josh
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rjamorim
post Jul 30 2005, 01:56
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QUOTE (jcoalson @ Jul 29 2005, 09:18 PM)
buy then why is wmal just "good"?  as a percentage of seats wmp blows away everything else away and that's not the only s/w it plays in.


For the precise reason it's not supported anywhere outside Windows or MacOS. If it was multiplatform, it would surely go straight to "very good" support.


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soiaf
post Jul 30 2005, 13:28
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QUOTE (jcoalson @ Jul 29 2005, 08:54 PM)
QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 29 2005, 01:01 PM)
QUOTE (jcoalson @ Jul 29 2005, 02:51 PM)
it's probably more useful to have that row be a range the same way 'software support' is

Josh
*


Hohoho. It was a range once. I ditched it for a boolean because we started bitching about ALAC status, and I figured a simple yes/no would be the best compromise. I don't plan to go back now.


the problem wasn't it being a range, the problem was the metric it was based on. ALAC and FLAC both said 'good' even though ALAC is supported on only one device. but right above it in the software row ALAC said 'bad' because it is supported in only one program.

you argued ALAC h/w support was 'good' because ipod is the #1 portable h/w device. but itunes penetration must be >= ipod penetration because you need itunes to use ipod.

I only argue that the table should be self-consistent in its metrics. and the most natural metric for h/w support is # of supporting devices, the same way that the current metric for s/w is # of supporting programs, because it is an indication of the degree of choice a user will have.

Josh
*



If its ok that the comparison table be changed because Rockbox does support WavPack albeit Rockbox itself is still in beta - and I myself do believe it is reasonable that it is added to the comparison table - then I should mention that WavPack is also available on the Roku Photobridge. Though of course version 2 of the Photobridge firmware which is the version that supports 'codec plugins' is also still in beta.

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jaybeee
post Jul 31 2005, 18:14
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Took the plunge and installed the 20050731 daily build... WOW, Rockbox is sooo good. I've got a lot of DJ mix CDs that I ripped as individual tracks, and it makes such a difference when they play gaplessly. Plus all the other goodies... still playing biggrin.gif


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SebastianG
post Jul 31 2005, 21:41
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QUOTE (jaybeee @ Jul 31 2005, 06:14 PM)
Took the plunge and installed the 20050731 daily build... WOW, Rockbox is sooo good.  I've got a lot of DJ mix CDs that I ripped as individual tracks, and it makes such a difference when they play gaplessly.  Plus all the other goodies... still playing  biggrin.gif
*


hey.. does it already work with MP3 ?
did you try it on files produced by pcutmp3 ?
This would be awesome!

I only tried Rockbox a month ago, but gapless mp3 didn't work back then.

Sebi
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jaybeee
post Jul 31 2005, 22:20
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QUOTE (SebastianG @ Jul 31 2005, 09:41 PM)
QUOTE (jaybeee @ Jul 31 2005, 06:14 PM)
Took the plunge and installed the 20050731 daily build... WOW, Rockbox is sooo good.  I've got a lot of DJ mix CDs that I ripped as individual tracks, and it makes such a difference when they play gaplessly.  Plus all the other goodies... still playing  biggrin.gif
*


hey.. does it already work with MP3 ?
did you try it on files produced by pcutmp3 ?
This would be awesome!

I only tried Rockbox a month ago, but gapless mp3 didn't work back then.

Sebi
*


Right, I've had a more careful listen and you can detect a very slight change when the next song starts. It also happens with files that have been cut with pcutmp3.
But it is a small 'glitch' (should I even use that word?); nothing like what the iRiver firmware does (that's a friggin joke).
If that's a good as it gets then I'll be happy; obviously I'll be ecstatic if it really is completely gapless.

Tell you what I love about the Rockbox firmware: when you fast-forward (seek) through a track, it speeds up the longer you're seeking... and the slows down nearing the end of the track... genius. cool.gif

EDIT: spelling & grammar

This post has been edited by jaybeee: Jul 31 2005, 22:22


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unfortunateson
post Jul 31 2005, 22:26
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Does anyone know of a good online place to purchase an H140? They seem to be hard to find. blink.gif
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jaybeee
post Jul 31 2005, 22:29
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QUOTE (unfortunateson @ Jul 31 2005, 10:26 PM)
Does anyone know of a good online place to purchase an H140?  They seem to be hard to find.  blink.gif
*

mp3players.co.uk say they have some in stock.


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Tang
post Sep 24 2005, 07:22
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ALAC fisrst basic support for Rockbox on iRiver iHP1xx... smile.gif
Cheers all smile.gif
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rasher
post Sep 24 2005, 13:18
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QUOTE (Tang @ Sep 24 2005, 08:22 AM)
ALAC fisrst basic support for Rockbox on iRiver iHP1xx... smile.gif
Cheers all smile.gif
*
It's not really basic. It works quite comfortably. After linuxstb fixed a problem with files produced by iTunes5.


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dobz
post Sep 24 2005, 21:06
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Rockbox now has presets for the radio, very handy indeed. The wiki contains country and region specific presets for download or create/edit your own on the fly.

Rockbox has had replaygain album and track mode for a while now but now has a new replaygain mode that enables you to use replaygain track mode when shuffle is enabled, very cool.

amazing work, im actualy runing out of features that i need that rockbox doesnt support.

EDIT:

oh darn it i couldnt help but mention that you can play rockboy games like tetris whilst listening to the radio smile.gif

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rjamorim
post Sep 24 2005, 21:18
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QUOTE (dobz @ Sep 24 2005, 05:06 PM)
amazing work, im actualy runing out of features that i need that rockbox doesnt support.
*


Remote LCD :B


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Tang
post Oct 4 2005, 16:50
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You should try a build with the Remote display patch it's simply amazing Roberto...

You can find a precompiled (by Zegille, thanks to him!!!) one here:
http://forum.hardware.fr/forum2.php?config...&nojs=0#t950259
note that with this build a patch that allow to use ReplayGain with APEv2 tag is also included... Isn't it lovely?

Here is the direct DL link:
http://kreuhn.kohrmahn.free.fr/rockbox.zip

Interesting quote of Rbx iRiverport Wiki:
QUOTE
AAC (MP4)  Code fully-working in simulator but not yet on iRiver, not yet checked in.


Even if Vorbis is now quite interesting i guess this should be a nice point to extend the actual multicodec support... wink.gif

Best regards,
Tanguy
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