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[SPAM] m4a pushing
guest0101
post May 4 2004, 21:22
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I am disappointed that this new update to the encoder doesn't allow .m4a file extension support yet when encoding/saving files. While Nero has been able to able to read .m4a files since the January update, it can't save using .m4a file extensions yet.

I have been asking for this feature for months to both Ivan and Menno, and I thought it was "a done deal". With every update I get my hopes up and hope that they added a simple toggle option under options to allow encoding/saving to a .m4a extension instead of .mp4. Again my hopes have been crashed with this update. I guess they were all too busy in Las Vegas last month to add this nice little feature...

With Apple, Real and WinAmp standardizing on (and exclusively using by default) the .m4a extension, Nero is really "behind the pack" by not allowing their customers (like me) to save encodes done with Nero to the .m4a extension... I am sadly disappointing (again) with Nero this month. I don't want to have to rename files after I make them with Nero.

And, no, I have no connection with M4A.COm any longer. I just want to see BOTH .m4a and .mp4 supported equally. Nero is one of the last "hold outs" sad.gif

In my opinion, supporting .m4a file extension saving is MUCH MORE important than parametic stereo support and anything else... Get it done guys, please...

Adam
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JohnV
post May 4 2004, 21:30
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QUOTE (guest0101 @ May 4 2004, 11:22 PM)
I am sadly disappointing (again) with Nero this month. I don't want to have to rename files after I make them with Nero.

And, no, I have no connection with M4A.COm any longer. I just want to see BOTH .m4a and .mp4 supported equally. Nero is one of the last "hold outs" sad.gif

In my opinion, supporting .m4a file extension saving is MUCH MORE important than parametic stereo support and anything else... Get it done guys, please...

Adam

Saving in .m4a much more important than anything else??
How long does it take to write "ren *.mp4 *.m4a" ? 2 seconds..
Imo supporting non-standard extension naming is not more important than technical improvements, especially since you can easily rename the files in few seconds if you need.


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guest0101
post May 4 2004, 21:33
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Since I am not a "techhead" like most of the loyal HA posters, that is the most important thing to me. Nero is a good program, but like is common, user interests and usability features sometimes get "pushed back" to technical engineering types.

Those "average users" who user the program (Nero) want a simple way to encode files that will work across all their popular programs. Doing a DOS command to rename files is not very user friendly in my opinion.

This is a classic "techhead" vs. user quality issue, and unfortunately the techs have been winning.

This post has been edited by guest0101: May 4 2004, 21:34
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krmathis
post May 4 2004, 21:40
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QUOTE (guest0101 @ May 4 2004, 10:33 PM)
Those "average users" who user the program (Nero) want a simple way to encode files that will work across all their popular programs. Doing a DOS command to rename files is not very user friendly in my opinion.

If you have problems getting a program to accept .mp4 you should definatelly contact its authors so the could add it in! wink.gif
Because afaik .mp4 is the standard extension for the MP4 container. The extensions .m4a and .m4v is non-standard extensions.

Solaris

This post has been edited by solaris: May 4 2004, 21:41
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guest0101
post May 4 2004, 21:48
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I have contacted the authors of Nero MPEG 4 Audio, both menno and Ivan. Both seemed to say they would add this feature.

I am just very disappointed with waiting for such a trivial thing to add (a simple check box to remeber a person's preferred file extension choice). Compaact has added this. And RealPlayer, Apple iTunes and WinAmp all encode to .m4a (and m4a only) by default.

So your point about .mp4 being a standard is moot, as they both are the same file container format (.mp4 and .m4a) just different naming conventions.

Nero has a choice to either work with all the other major consumer apps or "go its own way", which would likely isolate it from as broad of consumer acceptance.

I am entitled to my opinion, and I just expressed my displeasure that this update has (yet again) apparently ignored such an "easy to fix" problem with Nero working better for all its users. Enough said about this. The ball is in Ivan and Menno's court now.

This post has been edited by guest0101: May 4 2004, 21:53
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xmixahlx
post May 4 2004, 21:53
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QUOTE (guest0101 @ May 4 2004, 12:48 PM)
So your point about .mp4 being a standard is moot, as they both are the same file container format (.mp4 and .m4a) just different naming conventions.

um... no, you are wrong.

a standard != common user conventions

just like ogm isn't a standard container for ogg, but an extension that was adopted for ease of use.

...this is especially important due to the windows world of "i don't know what it is unless it has an extension i know of" mentality


later


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Dologan
post May 4 2004, 22:00
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Or you you could just call the nero encoder up from foobar2000, where you can choose the .m4a extension to MPEG4 files.

All you need is the foo_nero.dll plugin and you are set.

This post has been edited by Dologan: May 4 2004, 22:01
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Digga
post May 4 2004, 22:12
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QUOTE (guest0101 @ May 4 2004, 09:33 PM)
This is a classic "techhead" vs. user quality issue, and unfortunately the techs have been winning.

yes, very unfortunate to have left this feature alone, resulting in more time for tuning/quality feature implementation... very unfortunate indeed.


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rjamorim
post May 4 2004, 22:17
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QUOTE (Digga @ May 4 2004, 06:12 PM)
yes, very unfortunate to have left this feature alone, resulting in more time for tuning/quality feature implementation... very unfortunate indeed.

biggrin.gif

I don't understand this morbid obsession about file extensions. It makes sound like the world will end tomorrow if everybody doesn't start suporting both MP4 and M4A.


QUOTE
In my opinion, supporting .m4a file extension saving is MUCH MORE important than parametic stereo support and anything else...


blink.gif

This post has been edited by rjamorim: May 4 2004, 22:20


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Tec9SD
post May 5 2004, 03:13
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With all due respect, I was compelled to respond to what you've said.
I found your statements mind-bogglingly asinine.

QUOTE (guest0101 @ Aug 25 2003, 04:03 PM)
I guess they were all too busy in Las Vegas last month to add this nice little feature...
To me this is a sneering remark & completely uncalled for.

I don't see what has held it up from being added, seems like small trouble to me too, but that's how It is...

(Know of the adage "You can catch more flies with honey, then you can with vinegar."?)

I'm trying to empathize with you, but even with that, to say not embracing a standard, something which is constantly espoused by so many here, at HA, is more important then engineering fidelity leaves me with out words to respond especially when one considers the absolute simplicity of the work-around stop-gap solution.
Think about what you've said in this regard WMA is bad because (among other things) it is a proprietary format which follows no standard. Yet you want support for a non-standard file extension put above the sound quality of your files?!?

<OT>I am really deficient in batch programming but I will be glad to make a little script for you, or if you'd rather I could make a right-click context menu entry to change any MP4s found to M4A</OT>

QUOTE (guest0101 @ Aug 25 2003, 04:03 PM)
...
And about MPEG-4 & AAC being patented; even though this is true, it is also an open standard. It is guaranteed that what is an AAC today will still be an AAC ten years from now, and it is also guaranteed that anyone can buy rights to AAC on equal terms.
...

I feel the same way. I want an international standardized audio format that won't change (i.e. my files will play back correctly in the years to come), not a whimsical Microsoft WMA codec that they can change (or that they can drop from being supported in their player) in years to come.
...

As far as MP3 goes, the base MPEG 1 Level 3 format is an international standard, but the proprietary format (by Fraunhoffer and Coding Technologies) called MP3Pro is not an international standard. I would not like to see MP3Pro be accepted by the masses in place of the superior (according to international listening tests) HE AAC (when tested at low bitrates, which both HE AAC and MP3Pro are designed for).

I can sleep better once we have MP4 Audio (both AAC and HE AAC) established as a popular international standard that works in all our portable players and software apps.

from this post
I wrote a 2/3rds or more before I thought it would be unfair to be critical of what you said so here is a search I did, Search results for posts by you with microsoft in them
Honestly, your motivation is you desire direct support for iTunes and/or iPod, right? So how is Apple different from Microsoft in this regard? It's not moot to me, is it all moot?

hopefully this isn't a violation of "No Hateful or Disrespectful posts. This includes: bashing, name-calling or insults directed at a board member." but you may want to consider the hypocrisy of your words. Also your prospective.

It seems your contempt is focused on the wrong people (if rightfully it should even exist at all)

And, No, I don't use AAC, WMA, Vorbis nor do I have a vested interest of any kind in any of them. If forced to choose I have a short preference toward MP4 being the next big codec (due to its ISO status) short of that, It's really rather indifferent to me. I'm here because I greatly enjoy the science as much as anything else.

Also I believe solaris was referring to the other software companies who use M4A as the default, not Nero.
(Which seems like a good idea btw, it seems to me like this can only lead to better interoperability.


Awaiting the barrage sweat.gif, tec

This post has been edited by Tec9SD: May 5 2004, 03:27
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bond
post May 5 2004, 13:43
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i want a tool ala oggprak, which analyses a .mp4 file whether it contains a video stream or not
if it contains video, it passes the file to my video player
if it contains audio only, it passes it to my audio player laugh.gif

should be very easy doable, any volunteers? tongue.gif

or even better:
i want a player, which is usable for both audio-only and audio+video files biggrin.gif


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kl33per
post May 5 2004, 17:27
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QUOTE (bond @ May 5 2004, 10:43 PM)
i want a tool ala oggprak, which analyses a .mp4 file whether it contains a video stream or not
if it contains video, it passes the file to my video player
if it contains audio only, it passes it to my audio player  laugh.gif

should be very easy doable, any volunteers?  tongue.gif

That's a brilliant idea. Anyone who is willing to code that is a champ.


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Jebus
post May 5 2004, 17:37
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Guys it seems like a pretty simple compatibility feature request. Its not like adding an option for a different file extension would really take away from time that could have been spent tuning codecs. No need to get all huffy. Fact is most people using AAC right now want it for an iPod, they don't care whether or not the file extension is "standard" or not.
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Digga
post May 5 2004, 19:25
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QUOTE (Jebus @ May 5 2004, 05:37 PM)
Guys it seems like a pretty simple compatibility feature request. Its not like adding an option for a different file extension would really take away from time that could have been spent tuning codecs. No need to get all huffy.

well, it doesn't sound to complicated to implent, but it's always a matter of how you ask for things you want to have.
and to more or less hijack a thread in an arrogant way, with statments that could easily be considered unpolite or even hurting and arguments that aim more at a personal level than on the subject itself is IMHO not polite or constructive.

keeping in mind that easy workarounds have been pointed out by helpfull ppl, I guess this topic is worn out.


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guest0101
post May 5 2004, 22:48
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When developers fail to act in a reasonable time after they acknowledge that it is a good idea and probably should be implemented, the public is free to express their displeasure if the feature not being added yet. Freedom of speech and all that... No personal attacks, just wishing that a feature would be implemented sooner rather than later. Diplomacy has failed so public voicing of displeasure is necessary.

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