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Recommended Encoder Versions and Settings
QuantumKnot
post Sep 5 2003, 06:39
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Recommended Ogg Vorbis Encoders


Please check the more frequently updated wiki for recommended Ogg Vorbis encoders.

This post has been edited by QuantumKnot: Jul 19 2007, 13:08
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LiTEMaTTeR
post Jan 4 2005, 08:56
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hmmm... AO; aoTuV b2 [20040420] (based on Xiph.Org's 1.0.1) => aoTuV beta 2

Thats what I'm using with a foobar2000 encoder. I'm noticing something though. Using -q 5 which Im told is the min for transparency with this encoder, the bitrates seem to be lower than I get with 3.90.3 LAME's APS. I also did MPC for fun and found those to tend to be somewhere between OGG and MP3 at its stand setting.

Anyways, Ive tried to ABX a few tracks and I seem to not be able to tell that q5 sounds bad at all compared to the original. I used alot of tracks off FF123's problem sample FLACs and a few random wav's I had on my pc (mostly pop and urban style music). Its extremely hard for me to even hear any differences.

Im very excited about the lower bitrates but good quality still. But I don't wanna get my hopes up really fast just yet.

I have a few more questions about OGG as a format compared to mp3:

1) do u *have* to compare only pure bitrates i.e 192 ogg vs mp3 192. I'd really like to think OGG is giving me higher/equal(probably more accurate) quality at lower bitrates. Generally, speaking of course.

2) could one say q5 (ogg) = lame-aps (mp3) in terms of quality?

3) since ogg doesn't have alot of the same limitations mp3 has. I assume its encoding even the high freq content fine?

4) any GUI (like encospot) apps for OGG?

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QuantumKnot
post Jan 6 2005, 01:09
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QUOTE (LiTEMaTTeR @ Jan 4 2005, 05:56 PM)
Anyways, Ive tried to ABX a few tracks and I seem to not be able to tell that q5 sounds bad at all compared to the original. I used alot of tracks off FF123's problem sample FLACs and a few random wav's I had on my pc (mostly pop and urban style music). Its extremely hard for me to even hear any differences.


Transparency is subjective and is different to different people. I find it hard to hear artifacts at q 4 most of the time while some people can hear the the faintest of artifacts at q 7 or more. So it is dependent on your equipment as well as your hearing.

QUOTE
1) do u *have* to compare only pure bitrates i.e 192 ogg vs mp3 192. I'd really like to think OGG is giving me higher/equal(probably more accurate) quality at lower bitrates. Generally, speaking of course.


This has been the bone of contention for a while....how to compare VBR codecs. The usual practice has been to compare codecs which have similar average bitrates on most genres of music. So what that means is gathering lots and lots of music of different genres, and twiddling the VBR settings of both codecs until they achieve the same average bitrate (adding up all the bitrates and taking an average) on this material.

QUOTE
2) could one say q5 (ogg) = lame-aps (mp3) in terms of quality?


Only a listening test can answer that, and it will be dependent on different people. Have a search around the forums to see if someone has done a test comparing q 5 ogg vorbis with lame aps.

QUOTE
3) since ogg doesn't have alot of the same limitations mp3 has. I assume its encoding even the high freq content fine?


Theoretically, ogg vorbis was designed to overcome the limitations of mp3. But whether it has been tuned optimally is the important question. IMO, ogg vorbis has a lot of potential and the current encoder is not as well tuned as say, LAME.

QUOTE
4) any GUI (like encospot) apps for OGG?


You could try OggDropXPd. There are quite a few.

btw. Ogg is a file container that can contain video and audio. The actual audio codec is called Vorbis. wink.gif

This post has been edited by QuantumKnot: Jan 6 2005, 01:10
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Posts in this topic
- QuantumKnot   Recommended Encoder Versions and Settings   Sep 5 2003, 06:39
- - dev0   You should consider adding links to Garf's sit...   Nov 9 2003, 01:00
- - mekon21   @ QuantumKnot Thanks for the effort, this has bee...   Nov 10 2003, 13:26
- - Jaleel   What are the recommended Vorbis setting for 16k Vo...   Nov 26 2003, 17:36
- - ScorLibran   It should also be noted that with the GT3b1 encode...   Nov 27 2003, 03:19
- - vinu   QuantumKnot's "Recommended Encoder Versio...   Nov 29 2003, 02:19
- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (vinu @ Nov 29 2003, 11:19 AM)QuantumKn...   Nov 29 2003, 02:24
- - Soren   Time to update for the merged ogg encoder (GTb2 ba...   Dec 10 2003, 18:55
- - sramov   Can anyone update dll's for the CDex into GT3b...   Feb 16 2004, 14:09
- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (sramov @ Feb 16 2004, 11:09 PM)Can any...   Feb 16 2004, 23:40
- - john33   I'll post links for these as I am still withou...   Feb 16 2004, 23:53
- - john33   OK, I've made all the GT3b2 compiles that I...   Feb 16 2004, 23:59
- - QuantumKnot   I'm assuming the CDex dll's is the one nam...   Feb 17 2004, 00:03
- - john33   QUOTE (QuantumKnot @ Feb 16 2004, 11:03 PM)I...   Feb 17 2004, 00:08
- - OggZealot   It's great to see the 3 month after I asked it...   Feb 17 2004, 03:37
- - QuantumKnot   Point taken. I'll include the official encode...   Feb 17 2004, 10:39
- - prozak   Whatever is done, I think fixing the documentation...   Apr 1 2004, 02:17
- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (prozak @ Apr 1 2004, 11:17 AM)Whatever...   Apr 2 2004, 00:35
- - rjamorim   Update your links, dude. Everything is still poin...   Apr 2 2004, 00:57
- - QuantumKnot   Done   Apr 2 2004, 01:48
- - Tang   Hi QuantumKnot, I wanted to complain a little bit ...   May 10 2004, 01:58
- - QuantumKnot   This GT3b2 should be exactly the same as the one J...   May 10 2004, 02:13
- - Tang   QUOTE (QuantumKnot @ May 9 2004, 05:13 PM)Thi...   May 11 2004, 03:08
- - Prodoc   QUOTE (QuantumKnot)From the Vorbis listening test ...   May 24 2004, 23:54
- - eagleray   @QN From the way you did the headings it looks li...   May 25 2004, 00:09
- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (Prodoc @ May 25 2004, 08:54 AM)QUOTE (...   May 25 2004, 00:41
- - bani   QUOTE (QuantumKnot @ Sep 4 2003, 09:39 PM)[Li...   May 30 2004, 11:49
- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (bani @ May 30 2004, 08:49 PM)not very ...   May 30 2004, 11:56
- - de Mon   I also think GT3b2 can be newbie confusing. Actua...   Jun 13 2004, 23:05
- - xmixahlx   well, theres nothing "stable" about it ...   Jun 14 2004, 01:17
- - Tang   QUOTE (xmixahlx @ Jun 13 2004, 04:17 PM)well,...   Jun 24 2004, 14:24
- - kidi   Hi! Could somebody help me? : I`d like to ...   Jul 17 2004, 22:49
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (kidi @ Jul 18 2004, 07:49 AM)Hi! C...   Jul 18 2004, 03:34
- - NoXFeR   I think it would be nice if some information about...   Aug 3 2004, 14:52
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (NoXFeR @ Aug 3 2004, 11:52 PM)I think ...   Aug 7 2004, 02:34
- - esa372   QUOTE (QuantumKnot @ Sep 4 2003, 10:39 PM)How...   Sep 10 2004, 14:27
|- - Peter Harris   QUOTE (esa372 @ Sep 10 2004, 08:27 AM)But if ...   Sep 10 2004, 17:32
|- - esa372   QUOTE (QuantumKnot @ Sep 11 2004, 05:50 PM)es...   Sep 25 2004, 19:10
- - QuantumKnot   IIRC, the old Vorbis plugin bug caused the vendor ...   Sep 12 2004, 01:50
- - DreamTactix291   Just would like to add that the compile of 1.1 wit...   Sep 25 2004, 04:29
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (DreamTactix291 @ Sep 25 2004, 01:29 PM...   Sep 25 2004, 04:34
- - Garf   Prolly interesting to add: Xiphophorus libVorbis ...   Sep 25 2004, 19:16
- - Tang   Thanks for your EDIT of the 1st post QK... Very ni...   Sep 25 2004, 19:18
|- - jwu42   Nice revision there QK - much appreciated   Sep 26 2004, 17:10
- - sergelac   i'd like to use the new 1.1 but i hate these s...   Sep 27 2004, 03:33
- - esa372   Thanks for the update, QuantumKnot... excellent w...   Sep 27 2004, 05:24
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (esa372 @ Sep 27 2004, 02:24 PM)Thanks ...   Sep 27 2004, 11:50
|- - esa372   QUOTE (QuantumKnot @ Sep 27 2004, 03:50 AM)Th...   Sep 27 2004, 15:39
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (esa372 @ Sep 28 2004, 12:39 AM)Here...   Sep 28 2004, 00:37
- - esa372   Thanks for all your help, QK! It really help...   Sep 28 2004, 15:03
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (esa372 @ Sep 29 2004, 12:03 AM)Thanks ...   Sep 29 2004, 00:37
- - music_man_mpc   I was just wondering why there is no one recommend...   Sep 28 2004, 15:38
- - dawids   I just subscribed to Jetaudio 6 plus to enter the ...   Sep 28 2004, 22:59
- - esa372   Thanks again, QK, for all the info..! It...   Sep 29 2004, 15:02
- - Prodoc   @QuantumKnot:QUOTE INT (impulse_noisetune) however...   Oct 5 2004, 21:17
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (Prodoc @ Oct 6 2004, 06:17 AM)@Quantum...   Oct 6 2004, 02:57
- - LoFiYo   If this can be considered off-topic, I apologize i...   Oct 16 2004, 05:34
- - Madman2003   @QK: higher ITP are normally used with higher qual...   Oct 16 2004, 13:21
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (Madman2003 @ Oct 16 2004, 10:21 PM)@QK...   Oct 19 2004, 13:28
|- - Enig123   As we know ITP uses short blocks more frequently, ...   Oct 19 2004, 14:37
- - Gray_Wolf   Hi, i am very happy with the sound quality of this...   Oct 23 2004, 20:47
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (Gray_Wolf @ Oct 24 2004, 05:47 AM) Hi,...   Oct 24 2004, 02:29
|- - Gray_Wolf   QUOTE (QuantumKnot @ Oct 23 2004, 09:29 PM)Ye...   Oct 24 2004, 17:45
- - Patrick00   vorbis 1.1.0 -q7 great quality, transparent to my ...   Oct 24 2004, 23:38
|- - Gray_Wolf   QUOTE (Patrick00 @ Oct 24 2004, 06:38 PM)vorb...   Oct 25 2004, 12:12
|- - Patrick00   QUOTE (Gray_Wolf @ Oct 25 2004, 03:12 AM) I m...   Oct 25 2004, 23:33
|- - Gray_Wolf   QUOTE (Patrick00 @ Oct 25 2004, 06:33 PM)i re...   Oct 26 2004, 04:21
- - Poromenos   Actually -q-1 sounds better than mp3 128 to me... ...   Oct 25 2004, 18:19
- - [solid]   erm... don't shout on me please... i seriously...   Nov 14 2004, 11:08
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE ([solid] @ Nov 14 2004, 08:08 ...   Nov 15 2004, 00:42
- - [solid]   no no, i've meant: gt3b2 at quality 6 - can a ...   Nov 15 2004, 20:24
|- - Dologan   QUOTE ([solid] @ Nov 15 2004, 01:24 ...   Nov 16 2004, 01:31
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE ([solid] @ Nov 16 2004, 05:24 ...   Nov 16 2004, 02:33
- - Zoom   I just built an AMD64 system and was updating my s...   Nov 30 2004, 05:29
- - kotrtim   ......the bitrate is similar, 167kbps, so they are...   Nov 30 2004, 05:34
- - QuantumKnot   That's interesting, when considering that AMD3...   Nov 30 2004, 05:44
- - yong   Mimicking GT3b2 with 1.1 CODEfrom QuantumKnot...   Dec 3 2004, 11:58
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (yong @ Dec 3 2004, 08:58 PM)Mimicking ...   Dec 4 2004, 00:12
- - yong   @QuantumKnot: Thanks for the reply, but why try co...   Dec 4 2004, 14:36
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (yong @ Dec 4 2004, 11:36 PM)@QuantumKn...   Dec 4 2004, 15:16
- - zEn   is there a special oggenc version (with P4 optimiz...   Dec 29 2004, 17:26
- - TobWen   Hi there, I've been off this site for about a...   Dec 30 2004, 03:03
|- - music_man_mpc   QUOTE (TobWen @ Dec 29 2004, 06:03 PM)Hi ther...   Dec 30 2004, 03:27
- - QuantumKnot   Vorbis 1.1 is based on aoTuV beta 2. The recent a...   Dec 30 2004, 03:28
- - TobWen   thanks for your fast and professional help! Ac...   Dec 30 2004, 03:42
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (TobWen @ Dec 30 2004, 12:42 PM)thanks ...   Dec 30 2004, 03:45
- - LiTEMaTTeR   hmmm... AO; aoTuV b2 [20040420] (based on Xiph.Org...   Jan 4 2005, 08:56
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (LiTEMaTTeR @ Jan 4 2005, 05:56 PM)Anyw...   Jan 6 2005, 01:09
- - mono13   i find ogg's great in a komputer stg game onl...   Feb 1 2005, 05:35
- - Buffalo Bill   Great topic! Answered almost all my questions ...   Feb 14 2005, 06:27
- - QuantumKnot   I think EAC is still the best ripper for detecting...   Feb 14 2005, 06:35
- - Buffalo Bill   Yeah, but will EAC encode my OGG Vorbis files at 5...   Feb 14 2005, 06:44
|- - dewey1973   QUOTE (Buffalo Bill @ Feb 13 2005, 09:44 PM)Y...   Feb 17 2005, 18:25
- - DreamTactix291   If you tell it to call oggenc and encode at -q 10 ...   Feb 15 2005, 06:30
- - alter4   It seems new Qk test build is recommended encoder ...   Feb 28 2005, 09:55
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (alter4 @ Feb 28 2005, 06:55 PM)It seem...   Feb 28 2005, 11:16
- - Prodoc   Isn't the Oggenc2.4 serie (IMPULSE_TRIGGER_PRO...   Mar 3 2005, 12:44
|- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (Prodoc @ Mar 3 2005, 09:44 PM)Isn...   Mar 3 2005, 12:55
- - evilchickenking   I have an amd64 processor and i was curious to fin...   Mar 14 2005, 19:59
- - QuantumKnot   QUOTE (evilchickenking @ Mar 15 2005, 04:59 A...   Mar 15 2005, 00:43
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