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Pre-Test discussion, Looking for opinions.
rjamorim
post Jul 16 2003, 04:07
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Hello.

As most of you already know, I'm planning an extension test for the AAC@128kbps test. It'll be the AAC winner (QuickTime) versus Musepack, Vorbis, Lame ABR, WMAv9 and maybe Atrac3 (more on that later). The test should start (if everything goes right) in a week (the 23rd)

There are some subjects where I'm still not sure how to proceed, so I would like to rely on the forum users' knowledge:

1 - Should I include Atrac3 (used on Sony MiniDiscs and Real Audio at mid-high bitrates) in this test? Is there anyone out there interested in this format? (besides Den ;) )

2 - I plan to use anchors in this test. For those that don't know, anchors are samples that suffer no processing from the original apart from lowpass. They are used to put the results into perspective and avoid participants rating the encoded samples too high and/or too low. The questions that arise are:
a) 2 anchors (high and low) are needed, or only one anchor is enough? (IMO, two anchors are more useful in low bitrate tests, and don't make much sense in high bitrate ones)
b) JohnV votes for one lowpass for each sample, else some samples might sound better lowpassed than their original versions. ff123 votes for one fixed lowpass for all samples, to put things into perspective. What's your personal opinion?
c) Anyone has any idea of good lowpass(es) for the test? It's a difficult choice since low lowpasses might sound too unpleasant to the fellas with good hearing and pro gear, but high lowpasses might sound too transparent to the fellas with not-so-good hearing or simple gear.

Thanks for your help.

Regards;

Roberto Amorim.

This post has been edited by rjamorim: Jul 16 2003, 04:09


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guruboolez
post Jul 16 2003, 17:30
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One 'problem' with bachpsichord (and with beautyslept too, but at lower degree), is the bitrate reached with --radio profile : near 200 kbps...

P.S. What to you mean by "screw up" ?
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- rjamorim   Pre-Test discussion   Jul 16 2003, 04:07
- - rpop   I'd go along with JohnV on this one, since I...   Jul 16 2003, 04:22
- - ff123   I was thinking of a 10 kHz lowpass, which should s...   Jul 16 2003, 04:30
- - ff123   QUOTE (rpop @ Jul 15 2003, 07:22 PM)I'd g...   Jul 16 2003, 04:33
- - boojum   I would be interested in seeing how ATRAC stacks u...   Jul 16 2003, 05:41
- - Joseph   Someone should really create a Listening Tests For...   Jul 16 2003, 05:59
- - den   QUOTE Should I include Atrac3 (used on Sony MiniDi...   Jul 16 2003, 06:31
- - ff123   QUOTE (den @ Jul 15 2003, 09:31 PM)If you use...   Jul 16 2003, 06:53
- - den   QUOTE Sounds like a job for TotalRecorder. It...   Jul 16 2003, 07:26
- - ErikS   1. I'm also interested in how ATRAC performs c...   Jul 16 2003, 07:36
- - Gabriel   Even if atrac3 does not seems really interesting f...   Jul 16 2003, 08:14
- - den   QUOTE Sounds like a job for TotalRecorder. It...   Jul 16 2003, 10:01
- - guruboolez   The ACM ATRAC3 encoder is totally different from S...   Jul 16 2003, 11:01
- - bond   i vote for atrac3 too (there is an interest from t...   Jul 16 2003, 11:10
- - den   QUOTE In my opinion, ATRAC3 is interesting to incl...   Jul 16 2003, 12:33
- - S_O   I would like to see atrac3 in the test, too. Why d...   Jul 16 2003, 12:39
- - Tripwire   When you'll be trying WMA9, be sure to test bo...   Jul 16 2003, 12:41
- - JohnV   QUOTE (Tripwire @ Jul 16 2003, 02:41 PM)When ...   Jul 16 2003, 13:25
- - kl33per   QUOTE Personally I'd be ready to drop MusePack...   Jul 16 2003, 13:58
- - dev0   Personally I'd rather include Musepack than AT...   Jul 16 2003, 14:01
- - rjamorim   Hello, people. Thanks a lot for your help. About ...   Jul 16 2003, 16:10
- - djemberay   I'd be very interested in seeing how the encod...   Jul 16 2003, 16:18
- - guruboolez   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 16 2003, 04:10 PM)About...   Jul 16 2003, 17:10
- - ErikS   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 16 2003, 04:10 PM)About...   Jul 16 2003, 17:16
- - guruboolez   I forgot this one : SonicStage can be downloaded ...   Jul 16 2003, 17:24
- - ff123   I vote both for keeping Musepack and for using WMA...   Jul 16 2003, 17:25
- - ErikS   QUOTE (guruboolez @ Jul 16 2003, 05:10 PM)I s...   Jul 16 2003, 17:26
- - boojum   Ah, there's that harpsichord again. B) I a...   Jul 16 2003, 17:28
- - guruboolez   One 'problem' with bachpsichord (and with ...   Jul 16 2003, 17:30
- - ErikS   QUOTE (guruboolez @ Jul 16 2003, 05:30 PM)One...   Jul 16 2003, 17:31
- - guruboolez   QUOTE (ErikS @ Jul 16 2003, 05:31 PM)QUOTE (g...   Jul 16 2003, 17:36
- - ErikS   QUOTE (guruboolez @ Jul 16 2003, 05:36 PM)Is ...   Jul 16 2003, 17:42
- - bond   if it is generally accepted that wma9 pro will pro...   Jul 16 2003, 17:46
- - guruboolez   No problem. But for the moment, I must shut my com...   Jul 16 2003, 17:46
- - Gecko   I'm not in favor of adding any other form of l...   Jul 16 2003, 19:02
- - rjamorim   @Gecko: I think you didn't understand the purp...   Jul 16 2003, 19:46
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (ff123 @ Jul 16 2003, 01:25 PM)I vote b...   Jul 16 2003, 19:57
- - rjamorim   Ok, so what's (nearly) settled (unless someone...   Jul 16 2003, 20:05
- - JohnV   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 16 2003, 09:57 PM)QUOTE...   Jul 16 2003, 20:08
- - JohnV   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 16 2003, 10:05 PM)Ok, s...   Jul 16 2003, 20:14
- - ErikS   Where can I find this Bachpsichord samle?   Jul 16 2003, 20:23
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (JohnV @ Jul 16 2003, 04:08 PM)sack wma...   Jul 16 2003, 20:37
- - ff123   I'll try out blade tonight to see what it will...   Jul 16 2003, 20:45
- - Garf   Too bad Lifeshatters is out ... I found the clip ...   Jul 16 2003, 20:47
- - bond   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 16 2003, 08:37 PM)Atrac...   Jul 16 2003, 20:53
- - Sebastian Mares   I would like Atrac3 comparision!   Jul 16 2003, 21:04
- - ScorLibran   Is the testing something a newbie like myself coul...   Jul 16 2003, 21:14
- - Dibrom   I've only briefly skimmed this thread, so I co...   Jul 16 2003, 21:31
- - bond   imho the audience will be all people who transcode...   Jul 16 2003, 21:54
- - Gecko   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 16 2003, 07:46 PM)@Geck...   Jul 16 2003, 22:00
- - S_O   QUOTE Heck, Atrac3 loses to other codecs (in featu...   Jul 16 2003, 23:20
- - bond   QUOTE (S_O @ Jul 16 2003, 11:20 PM)By the way...   Jul 16 2003, 23:38
- - rjamorim   Here I come again. @Dibrom: about the target audi...   Jul 16 2003, 23:52
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (S_O @ Jul 16 2003, 07:20 PM)This is no...   Jul 17 2003, 00:01
- - rjamorim   It's me again. I just want to inform you that...   Jul 17 2003, 00:20
- - bond   QUOTE (S_O @ Jul 16 2003, 11:20 PM)And for wm...   Jul 17 2003, 00:27
- - JohnV   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 17 2003, 01:52 AM)@Geck...   Jul 17 2003, 00:36
- - den   @Roberto and others My understanding is that the ...   Jul 17 2003, 01:34
- - den   Sorry to double up, but there are also ways to pla...   Jul 17 2003, 01:43
- - den   Me again... Last time this time, really... I j...   Jul 17 2003, 04:02
- - magic75   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 16 2003, 10:57 AM)QUOTE...   Jul 17 2003, 07:27
- - guruboolez   Short reply : - Sorry, I haven't test Beauty...   Jul 17 2003, 11:24
- - ErikS   QUOTE (guruboolez @ Jul 17 2003, 11:24 AM)Sho...   Jul 17 2003, 12:18
- - guruboolez   I compared the sample Beautyslept at radio profile...   Jul 17 2003, 19:57
- - Tripwire   The reason why I'm asking to include WMA9Pro i...   Jul 17 2003, 20:50
- - amano   hmm. maybe it sounds like a complete newbie questi...   Jul 18 2003, 03:48
- - karl_lillevold   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 16 2003, 03:01 PM)We ne...   Jul 18 2003, 06:06
- - ff123   QUOTE (amano @ Jul 17 2003, 06:48 PM)hmm. may...   Jul 18 2003, 06:18
- - amano   ok. thanks. didn't use the wme ever. so I thou...   Jul 18 2003, 15:04
- - Nic   The OpenMG software does come with a directshow fi...   Jul 18 2003, 15:37
- - den   QUOTE The OpenMG software does come with a directs...   Jul 19 2003, 00:27
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (bond @ Jul 16 2003, 08:27 PM)QUOTE (rj...   Jul 19 2003, 01:54
- - amano   sounds great to me. and by having mp3 and vorbis i...   Jul 19 2003, 02:33
- - den   QUOTE The Masses test would compare QuickTime, Lam...   Jul 19 2003, 06:05
- - bond   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 19 2003, 02:54 AM)The M...   Jul 19 2003, 11:16
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (den @ Jul 19 2003, 02:05 AM)I agree in...   Jul 19 2003, 15:49
- - ff123   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 19 2003, 06:49 AM)@ff12...   Jul 19 2003, 17:11
- - rpop   So the masses test is the one scheduled to start W...   Jul 19 2003, 17:32
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (rpop @ Jul 19 2003, 01:32 PM)So the ma...   Jul 19 2003, 19:55
- - ff123   Roberto, Before you start the test, could you upl...   Jul 19 2003, 22:11
- - guruboolez   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 19 2003, 01:54 AM)The M...   Jul 19 2003, 23:34
- - bond   1) plz dont forget that the tests are about sound ...   Jul 19 2003, 23:39
- - guruboolez   QUOTE (bond @ Jul 19 2003, 11:39 PM)plz dont ...   Jul 19 2003, 23:51
- - bond   ups crosspost added point 2 and 3 in my last pos...   Jul 20 2003, 00:03
- - rjamorim   Hello. @Guruboolez: I understand your concern abo...   Jul 20 2003, 00:17
- - bond   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 20 2003, 01:17 AM)...   Jul 20 2003, 00:37
- - guruboolez   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 20 2003, 12:17 AM)@Guru...   Jul 20 2003, 01:28
- - ff123   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 19 2003, 03:17 PM)@ff12...   Jul 22 2003, 04:20
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (ff123 @ Jul 22 2003, 12:20 AM)Yes, the...   Jul 23 2003, 23:16
- - bond   QUOTE (rjamorim @ Jul 24 2003, 12:16 AM)Atrac...   Jul 23 2003, 23:27
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (bond @ Jul 23 2003, 07:27 PM)gimme, gi...   Jul 24 2003, 00:32
- - den   Good stuff Roberto. I think you have made the righ...   Jul 24 2003, 01:34
- - rjamorim   QUOTE (den @ Jul 23 2003, 09:34 PM)Good stuff...   Jul 24 2003, 02:58


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