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RCA VS XLR
Dark_wizzie
post Oct 17 2013, 11:40
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Hi,

1)
I have the Asus STX sound card. I'm using the cruddy Logitech z2300s, so it's a 2.1 setup, subwoofer, two speakers. I'm thinking of getting the Rokit 5s. So I use RCA plugs and plug them into my subwoofer and plug that into sound card? The subwoofer for z2300 is a single 3mm jack, which I can convert into two RCA cables. Is that going to affect the sound quality?

2)
The Asus STX does not have a way to accept XLR. What do you think about XLR vs RCA in terms of sound quality? I'm talking about the length of the cable being 6 feet max.


Thanks
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RonaldDumsfeld
post Oct 17 2013, 13:12
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I don't think that's going to work mate.

Check you documentation thoroughly. I may be wrong or there may be different versions in different territories.

As I understand the situation. All the amplifiers are in the Z2300 sub box. The satellites are passive. The KRKs are active monitors. So they already have their own amplifiers. They need to be connected to a balanced or unbalanced line level source. Not direct to an pre amplified signal.

Hope I'm wrong because otherwise it looks as if you will need to spend more money. Maybe even throw something away.
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julf
post Oct 17 2013, 13:46
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QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 17 2013, 12:40) *
What do you think about XLR vs RCA in terms of sound quality?


The connectors themselves (unless badly oxidized or something) don't make a difference to sound quality. XLR connectors are usually used for balanced connections, and RCA conectors for unbalanced. The difference between balanced and unbalanced is mainly that balanced is more immune to noise/hum, but it really only makes a difference when doing really long cable runs (as in a studio/PA scenario).
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aztec_mystic
post Oct 17 2013, 13:48
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Of the cheap Logitech 2.1 computer speakers I've seen, the sub has some sort of proprietary outs for the satellites. Moreover, not sure if the outs are line-level. (Instead, I suspect what Ron says is correct.)

The Rokit's are full range** so you can hook them up directly to your sound card's RCA outs. Just get two mono RCA cables from monoprice.com or the like.

--

** The 5" woofer doesn't go all that far down and, for certain uses, you might want to add a sub later down the road. In that case, it would probably be advisable to get something a little better than the cheap sub you got.

This post has been edited by aztec_mystic: Oct 17 2013, 13:51
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julf
post Oct 17 2013, 13:56
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QUOTE (aztec_mystic @ Oct 17 2013, 14:48) *
** The 5" woofer doesn't go all that far down and, for certain uses, you might want to add a sub later down the road. In that case, it would probably be advisable to get something a little better than the cheap sub you got.


Indeed, but if you really want to keep using the logitech subwoofer, you can drive the (active) Rockits from the logitech headphone output - it has the attenuated (by volume pot) line in signal.

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Dark_wizzie
post Oct 17 2013, 14:08
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QUOTE (RonaldDumsfeld @ Oct 17 2013, 05:12) *
I don't think that's going to work mate.

Check you documentation thoroughly. I may be wrong or there may be different versions in different territories.

As I understand the situation. All the amplifiers are in the Z2300 sub box. The satellites are passive. The KRKs are active monitors. So they already have their own amplifiers. They need to be connected to a balanced or unbalanced line level source. Not direct to an pre amplified signal.

Hope I'm wrong because otherwise it looks as if you will need to spend more money. Maybe even throw something away.

QUOTE (aztec_mystic @ Oct 17 2013, 05:48) *
Of the cheap Logitech 2.1 computer speakers I've seen, the sub has some sort of proprietary outs for the satellites. Moreover, not sure if the outs are line-level. (Instead, I suspect what Ron says is correct.)

The Rokit's are full range** so you can hook them up directly to your sound card's RCA outs. Just get two mono RCA cables from monoprice.com or the like.

--

** The 5" woofer doesn't go all that far down and, for certain uses, you might want to add a sub later down the road. In that case, it would probably be advisable to get something a little better than the cheap sub you got.


The satellite speakers plug into the subwoofer through a cable that looks like a typical RCA cable here, but one is yellow, one is black. So...

Ronald, from what I see you seem to be right.
My question then becomes: Can something like a Dayton Sub 800 work if I plug the Rokits into them? You know, if I upgrade. On the bright side if I completely replace my z2300, I can sell the entire set for some money. It's hard to sell satellite speakers only.
And I heard Rokits have some bass in them. I'm not *that* big into bass like my friends... a few of my friends has the "loud, cranked up bass = audio fidelity" mantra. I just set the bass to normal on the z2300. You figure Rockit's bass can be a short term substitute for the z2300 bass?

The most I can think of is to have Rokits plug into a new subwoofer (thinking of Dayton SUB-800), have the subwoofer plug into the sound card. I'm not sure what plug that sub uses, if it's the 3 mm jack then I use the 3mm to dual RCA converter. Is that ok or will I suffer some penalty for that?
I won't be sticking with the z2300 forever, I do plan to upgrade... down the road, anyways. z2300 and Rokits and STX is kind of a contradiction.

It'd be pretty rageworthy to buy Dayton sub to appease the Rokits only to find out for some odd reason it won't work. laugh.gif



Thanks for the replies guys! cool.gif
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julf
post Oct 17 2013, 14:29
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QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 17 2013, 15:08) *
Can something like a Dayton Sub 800 work if I plug the Rokits into them?


No. It seems the dayton sub-800 has speaker-level outputs. What you need is a splitter cable that takes your line-level signal to both the sub and the main speakers.
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Dark_wizzie
post Oct 17 2013, 14:34
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QUOTE (julf @ Oct 17 2013, 06:29) *
QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 17 2013, 15:08) *
Can something like a Dayton Sub 800 work if I plug the Rokits into them?


No. It seems the dayton sub-800 has speaker-level outputs. What you need is a splitter cable that takes your line-level signal to both the sub and the main speakers.

Does that have any effect on audio quality?

This could be done with the old Logitech sub as well right?

This post has been edited by Dark_wizzie: Oct 17 2013, 14:42
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RonaldDumsfeld
post Oct 17 2013, 14:49
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Yeah. Like julf says. The Dayton is no advance on the Logitech.

The Dayton sub only claims to go down to 40Hz anyway. (which is mostly fine for home use btw). The correct solution is to get either a more expensive sub with pass through or a multi channel audio interface. Or ideally both. Unfortunately that will cost money which since you are buying KRK I suspect you don't have right now.

What I suggest you do is put the money for the KRKs and the sub together. Sell the Logitech if you can. Put all the cash together and get a set of active monitors with 6" or 7" cones. They typically go down to 45Hz on their own anyway. ADAM F7 would be my choice but there are many alternatives. Add a sub later if you feel you need it and you have a bit more money to spare.

In the end your mains are your mains. Get the best you can afford to cover the audio spectrum where you are getting 90% of the information. Top and bottom is luxury.
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julf
post Oct 17 2013, 14:57
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QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 17 2013, 15:34) *
Does that have any effect on audio quality?


No.

QUOTE
This could be done with the old Logitech sub as well right?


Yes, but using the headphone output of the logitech is easier. It seems it is simply split off the signal feed through the volume pot in the logitech pod.
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Dark_wizzie
post Oct 17 2013, 14:58
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QUOTE (RonaldDumsfeld @ Oct 17 2013, 06:49) *
Yeah. Like julf says. The Dayton is no advance on the Logitech.

The Dayton sub only claims to go down to 40Hz anyway. (which is mostly fine for home use btw). The correct solution is to get either a more expensive sub with pass through or a multi channel audio interface. Or ideally both. Unfortunately that will cost money which since you are buying KRK I suspect you don't have right now.

What I suggest you do is put the money for the KRKs and the sub together. Sell the Logitech if you can. Put all the cash together and get a set of active monitors with 6" or 7" cones. They typically go down to 45Hz on their own anyway. ADAM F7 would be my choice but there are many alternatives. Add a sub later if you feel you need it and you have a bit more money to spare.

In the end your mains are your mains. Get the best you can afford to cover the audio spectrum where you are getting 90% of the information. Top and bottom is luxury.

Aww. crying.gif
A guy is selling two Rokit 5s for $150 total though.
QUOTE (julf @ Oct 17 2013, 06:57) *
QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 17 2013, 15:34) *
Does that have any effect on audio quality?


No.

QUOTE
This could be done with the old Logitech sub as well right?


Yes, but using the headphone output of the logitech is easier. It seems it is simply split off the signal feed through the volume pot in the logitech pod.

The headphone output on the volume control module has only one plug though. So I need to convert x2 RCA to 3mm, right?

This post has been edited by Dark_wizzie: Oct 17 2013, 15:01
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julf
post Oct 17 2013, 14:58
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QUOTE (RonaldDumsfeld @ Oct 17 2013, 15:49) *
In the end your mains are your mains. Get the best you can afford to cover the audio spectrum where you are getting 90% of the information. Top and bottom is luxury.


I agree.
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Dark_wizzie
post Oct 17 2013, 15:02
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QUOTE (julf @ Oct 17 2013, 06:58) *
QUOTE (RonaldDumsfeld @ Oct 17 2013, 15:49) *
In the end your mains are your mains. Get the best you can afford to cover the audio spectrum where you are getting 90% of the information. Top and bottom is luxury.


I agree.

I see.
First I have to decide how much I'm willing to pay. unsure.gif
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RonaldDumsfeld
post Oct 17 2013, 16:47
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Oh dear. Sorry I spoke now.

Fair enough. Do what julf says. Take it from there. It'll be fine.
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greynol
post Oct 17 2013, 17:54
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QUOTE (julf @ Oct 17 2013, 06:57) *
Yes, but using the headphone output of the logitech is easier.

Won't it mute the sub?


--------------------
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DVDdoug
post Oct 17 2013, 19:11
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This should work:

Get a stereo 3.5mm Y-adapter. AKA a "splitter" with one male and two females, like you would use to connect two pairs of headphones.

Plug the Y-adapter into your soundcard.

Plug the Logitech speakers into the Y-Adapter.

Get an adapter that has a male 3.5mm stereo connector on one end, and two female RCA connectors on the other end. (You might want two of these in case you want to use something like the Daton sub later.)

Plug that 3.5mm-to-RCA adapter into the Y-adapter and connect the Rokits.


----------------------
After all of this, you may find the Rokits sound better without the subwoofer... I haven't heard your Logitech so I'm not judging it, but a cheap subwoofer with "boomy one-note bass" can be worse (for sound reproduction accuracy) than no subwoofer at all.

Of course Rokit also makes subwoofers which I assume easily hook-up with their main monitors and they probably also integrate well acoustically.

This post has been edited by DVDdoug: Oct 17 2013, 19:16
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Dark_wizzie
post Oct 18 2013, 06:19
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QUOTE (DVDdoug @ Oct 17 2013, 11:11) *
This should work:

Get a stereo 3.5mm Y-adapter. AKA a "splitter" with one male and two females, like you would use to connect two pairs of headphones.

Plug the Y-adapter into your soundcard.

Plug the Logitech speakers into the Y-Adapter.

Get an adapter that has a male 3.5mm stereo connector on one end, and two female RCA connectors on the other end. (You might want two of these in case you want to use something like the Daton sub later.)

Plug that 3.5mm-to-RCA adapter into the Y-adapter and connect the Rokits.


----------------------
After all of this, you may find the Rokits sound better without the subwoofer... I haven't heard your Logitech so I'm not judging it, but a cheap subwoofer with "boomy one-note bass" can be worse (for sound reproduction accuracy) than no subwoofer at all.

Of course Rokit also makes subwoofers which I assume easily hook-up with their main monitors and they probably also integrate well acoustically.

Hmm... ok.
Well turns out the guy with the Rokit 5s are generation 1s. For $150. Good deal or should I buy from amazon, they got for like $220 + tax on amazon...

QUOTE (' post=')
Won't it mute the sub?

True, good point!
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julf
post Oct 18 2013, 10:24
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QUOTE (greynol @ Oct 17 2013, 18:54) *
Won't it mute the sub?


Ah, good point. Fortunately very easy to check.

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Dark_wizzie
post Oct 18 2013, 12:24
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QUOTE (julf @ Oct 18 2013, 02:24) *
QUOTE (greynol @ Oct 17 2013, 18:54) *
Won't it mute the sub?


Ah, good point. Fortunately very easy to check.

It does mute the speaker. I remember using that headphone connection a while back.
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ErnestS
post Oct 18 2013, 14:05
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QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 18 2013, 07:19) *
Well turns out the guy with the Rokit 5s are generation 1s. For $150. Good deal or should I buy from amazon, they got for like $220 + tax on amazon...

According to a review from Sound&Recording 8/2008, KRK improved the stereo imaging on the G2 compared to the G1.

I would get the G2 over the G1.

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greynol
post Oct 18 2013, 15:06
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QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 18 2013, 04:24) *
It does mute the speaker. I remember using that headphone connection a while back.

It might not be that difficult to defeat, if you're comfortable doing that sort of thing.


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Dark_wizzie
post Oct 18 2013, 15:50
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QUOTE (greynol @ Oct 18 2013, 07:06) *
QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 18 2013, 04:24) *
It does mute the speaker. I remember using that headphone connection a while back.

It might not be that difficult to defeat, if you're comfortable doing that sort of thing.

I'm not sure what that actually entails me doing, so I'm not sure.


BTW,
Any way to combine 2 RCA cables with a 3mm input (3mm is from subwoofer)? Maybe that will fix the problem.

This post has been edited by Dark_wizzie: Oct 18 2013, 15:54
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pdq
post Oct 18 2013, 15:57
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QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 18 2013, 10:50) *
QUOTE (greynol @ Oct 18 2013, 07:06) *
QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 18 2013, 04:24) *
It does mute the speaker. I remember using that headphone connection a while back.

It might not be that difficult to defeat, if you're comfortable doing that sort of thing.

I'm not sure what that actually entails me doing, so I'm not sure.

If you check the headphone socket you will find that inserting a plug opens two switch contacts that go to the speakers. All you have to do is connect across the contacts of each switch so that the speakers get the signal whether or not something is plugged in there.
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Dark_wizzie
post Oct 18 2013, 16:12
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QUOTE (pdq @ Oct 18 2013, 07:57) *
QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 18 2013, 10:50) *
QUOTE (greynol @ Oct 18 2013, 07:06) *
QUOTE (Dark_wizzie @ Oct 18 2013, 04:24) *
It does mute the speaker. I remember using that headphone connection a while back.

It might not be that difficult to defeat, if you're comfortable doing that sort of thing.

I'm not sure what that actually entails me doing, so I'm not sure.

If you check the headphone socket you will find that inserting a plug opens two switch contacts that go to the speakers. All you have to do is connect across the contacts of each switch so that the speakers get the signal whether or not something is plugged in there.

Is there some sort of guide on Youtube?
I'm not sure what to search for to find an example, lol. (If there is one.) laugh.gif
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DVDdoug
post Oct 19 2013, 00:28
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QUOTE
BTW,
Any way to combine 2 RCA cables with a 3mm input (3mm is from subwoofer)? Maybe that will fix the problem.
Sorry, I'm not sure what's an input, what's an output, and what connects to those 3.5mm & RCA connectors.

See if you can so something with this and this.

QUOTE
Is there some sort of guide on Youtube?
I'm not sure what to search for to find an example, lol. (If there is one.)
Unless you already have a soldering iron and you've soldered wires to connectors, etc., "hacking" a perfectly good Logitech speaker is probably not the best place to start. (It would be best to start learning something like that by building or repairing cables, or by attempting a repair on something that's broken.)

With that warning - You should be able to find instructions to wire-up a connector like that, but you probably won't find instructions for re-wiring the connector. Sometimes, it's not so easy to figure-out which solder-terminal is which... If it was me, I'd check the connections with my multimeter before & after soldering.



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