IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
Fingerprints can oxidize CD-Rs !, pictures
Pio2001
post Dec 13 2002, 20:29
Post #1


Moderator


Group: Super Moderator
Posts: 3936
Joined: 29-September 01
Member No.: 73



Unbelievable, but the silver actually oxydized exactly where I put my fingers : http://pageperso.aol.fr/lyonpio2001/pictur...cdr/hispace.htm
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Trelane
post Dec 13 2002, 20:39
Post #2


Crossfeed Developer


Group: Developer
Posts: 253
Joined: 24-January 02
From: Enola, PA, USA
Member No.: 1152



The first generation Verbatim 2X discs had a problem similar to this. Any kind of finger print on the label not only left an ugly mark, but it also broke down over time. These discs were also extremely sensitive to heat... one or two days in a hot car, and the label side would easily peel off--rendering the disc useless.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
LordSyl
post Dec 13 2002, 22:07
Post #3





Group: Members
Posts: 198
Joined: 19-October 02
From: Valencia
Member No.: 3577



Grand Advance Technology? are you sure those are made by MPO?

My MPO discs have "Unknown" manufacturer.

ATIP is 97m25s07f on a Hi-Space Carbon CD

This post has been edited by SyeltH: Dec 13 2002, 22:11
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Pio2001
post Dec 13 2002, 22:18
Post #4


Moderator


Group: Super Moderator
Posts: 3936
Joined: 29-September 01
Member No.: 73



Yes, "made in France by MPO".
They were certainly not having stampers of their own at this time and were using Grand Advance Technology ones. We've been warned many times that ATIP doesn't really tell the manufacturer.
They are very different from the HiSpace of nowadays, though, they are dark cyanine.
Silver ones are 12x certified. The gold one is 6x certified.

MPOs are recognized as MPO by CDRidentifier. Example of recent HiSpace Gold :

ATIP: 97m 25s 07f
Disc Manufacturer: MPO
Reflective layer: Dye (Short strategy; e.g. Phthalocyanine)
Media type: CD-Recordable
Recording Speeds: min. unknown - max. unknown
nominal Capacity: 702.69MB (79m 59s 00f / LBA: 359775)
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
atom
post Dec 14 2002, 03:53
Post #5





Group: Members
Posts: 28
Joined: 28-October 02
From: London, UK
Member No.: 3644



I have several original discs with the same problem. It only really became apparent when I tried to archive them to computer recently, with rips failing despite the disc surface appearing to be clean.

All my discs with this problem are ones which do not have a full-surface print label. It seems that the ink provides sufficient protection to prevent damage to the silver layer.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Andavari
post Dec 14 2002, 10:48
Post #6





Group: Members
Posts: 935
Joined: 3-June 02
From: USA
Member No.: 2204



QUOTE (Trelane @ Dec 13 2002 - 01:39 PM)
The first generation Verbatim 2X discs had a problem similar to this. Any kind of finger print on the label not only left an ugly mark, but it also broke down over time.

The 4x Verbatim DataLife Plus "had" the same problem. I watched one die when the label fell off, this happened in a mere three months after getting a finger print on the label side.


--------------------
Complexity of incoherent design.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Pio2001
post Dec 14 2002, 14:13
Post #7


Moderator


Group: Super Moderator
Posts: 3936
Joined: 29-September 01
Member No.: 73



Original discs are made of aluminium, not silver...

The conclusion, anyway, is "keep your CD clean on both sides !"
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Guest_SK1_*
post Dec 14 2002, 19:20
Post #8





Guests






This sucks... (not the test, the result smile.gif)
As time goes by i get more and more frightened by what may happen to my CDs, and how it may be too late then, and how bad CDs are and damn those who designed those stupid things smile.gif they could at least make them diskette like..(something like say mini discs) and all the CD reading devices we know would have been different, and so on and so on...
Ah how i wish things were different and CDs were much more reliable and could store information for a really long time and tolerate heat better.
Well, that's enough with my weirdo personal thoughts.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
R-Hunter
post Dec 14 2002, 21:16
Post #9





Group: Members
Posts: 27
Joined: 6-July 02
Member No.: 2494



Cost was probably a major factor in designing CDs. Building an external case around them for protection would dramaticall raise costs, not just for production, but for shipping as well since you could then fit fewer onto the transport trucks and ships. And you could probably forget about seeing spindle of 100 CD-Rs as well if they were disket like.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Guest_SK1_*
post Dec 14 2002, 21:35
Post #10





Guests






Yeah i guess cost was the major reason.. though i don't think it would dramatically raise the price. But still, yeah, in the long run it's paid off well for them.
About shipping cost, naa.. I bet a covered CD could very easily fit into a box just as big as of a regular CD.
But yeah, 100 CD-R spindles wouldn't exist then, not that i'd care, i'd never buy a 100 CD-R spindle smile.gif..
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
cd-rw.org
post Dec 14 2002, 21:36
Post #11





Group: Members
Posts: 176
Joined: 5-October 01
Member No.: 217



The conclusion is: Pio, wash your hands.
rolleyes.gif


--------------------
http://www.bitburners.com - We Burn a Bit
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
AutumnRain
post Dec 31 2002, 23:31
Post #12





Group: Members
Posts: 59
Joined: 8-December 02
Member No.: 4019



this is scary .......
How do I find this info. -i.e.....
QUOTE
ATIP: 97m 25s 07f
Disc Manufacturer: MPO
Reflective layer: Dye (Short strategy; e.g. Phthalocyanine)
Media type: CD-Recordable
Recording Speeds: min. unknown - max. unknown
nominal Capacity: 702.69MB (79m 59s 00f / LBA: 359775)
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Artemis3
post Jan 1 2003, 00:10
Post #13





Group: Members
Posts: 515
Joined: 29-September 01
Member No.: 68



QUOTE (cd-rw.org @ Dec 14 2002 - 04:36 PM)
The conclusion is: Pio, wash your hands.
rolleyes.gif

And don't eat popcorn while you handle the discs (hey you ppl watching DVDs take note)

Just for the fun of it i just took a 1996/97 burned disc. Looks great, reads fine too, no marks:
(gold/green)

ATIP: 97m 32s 00f
Disc Manufacturer: TDK Corp.
Reflective layer: Dye (Long strategy; e.g. Cyanine, Azo etc.)
Media type: CD-Recordable
Recording Speeds: min. unknown - max. unknown
nominal Capacity: 652.29MB (74m 15s 00f / LBA: 333975)


Hehhe, ah the good old days, but don't worry, another disc of that same era, same brand and everything developed a hole of its own in the middle, go figure...

I have another very recent no name disc and it looks like those pics and its having more and more read failures (already backed up), lets see what CDRIdentifier says: (silver/light blue)

ATIP: 97m 27s 28f
Disc Manufacturer: Princo Co.
Reflective layer: Dye (Short strategy; e.g. Phthalocyanine)
Media type: CD-Recordable
Recording Speeds: min. unknown - max. unknown
nominal Capacity: 657.42MB (74m 50s 01f / LBA: 336601)

So thats it... Cheap brands and bad habits don't mix either tongue.gif

Hmm do you know what the habit of smoking does to electronic components? I won't even think what it will do to CDs...


--------------------
She is waiting in the air
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Pio2001
post Jan 1 2003, 01:51
Post #14


Moderator


Group: Super Moderator
Posts: 3936
Joined: 29-September 01
Member No.: 73



I've got the solution : these stupid pieces of CD were not varnished until their center. The part oxydized is pure silver exposed to open air. It is normal that it oxydizes !

How do I know ? I just checked with an Ohm-meter ! The inner ring it conductive, while the rest of the surface is not
headbang.gif
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
mpcfiend
post Jan 1 2003, 03:42
Post #15





Group: Members
Posts: 125
Joined: 13-January 02
From: Cold Lake, Alberta
Member No.: 997



QUOTE
Hehhe, ah the good old days, but don't worry, another disc of that same era, same brand and everything developed a hole of its own in the middle, go figure...


Really? I'd think that the hole should've come standard with it. wink.gif

QUOTE
Hmm do you know what the habit of smoking does to electronic components? I won't even think what it will do to CDs...


I was always under the impression that cancer only effected biological organisms. tongue.gif

C'mon people, it's New Years! Have a sense of humor...this is not a troll. Just a very drunk attempt of humor. B)

Have a safe evening, and enjoy the party. smile.gif


--------------------
The sky is blue.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Tinribs
post Jan 1 2003, 04:43
Post #16





Group: Members
Posts: 141
Joined: 15-April 02
Member No.: 1786



smile.gif hey MPCFiend, I was ready to shout 'troll' then, but its good to see a fellow 'drunkard' lightening the tone wink.gif
Happy New Year To You All



ps In relation to this thread I was wondering (albeit a little weirdly) what the increased degradation results might be of urine stained fingers on discs,you go to the lav, you return and change disc........
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
LordofStars
post Jan 1 2003, 05:04
Post #17





Group: Members
Posts: 353
Joined: 28-April 02
Member No.: 1894



Back in the day there were optional drives for cd's. You would put it in a case called a caddy and stick the entire caddy into the drives. That way you only touched your cd once. The whole time you had it.


--------------------
r3mix zealot.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
mpcfiend
post Jan 1 2003, 07:16
Post #18





Group: Members
Posts: 125
Joined: 13-January 02
From: Cold Lake, Alberta
Member No.: 997



I had one of those, back in the day. Course, it was a 2x cdrom, and when i got a faster one it fell into disuse. smile.gif That was a great idea. I think a few of the MO drives back before CD-R(w) came into widespread use also had cartridged media. Great idea, I would love to see the new blu-ray discs cunsumerised with the use of a cartridge. Tighter packed grooves would mean that more data would be rendered unavailable with the same-sized scratch as a dvd/cd. Could also cut back on the need for extensive error-correction data on other parts of the disc, thereby freeing up disc space for extra unrelated data.

Just my thoughts. Chances are that cartridges won't make it to consumerised implementations, despite the numerous advantages. B)


--------------------
The sky is blue.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Andavari
post Jan 1 2003, 07:56
Post #19





Group: Members
Posts: 935
Joined: 3-June 02
From: USA
Member No.: 2204



QUOTE (Artemis3 @ Dec 31 2002 - 05:10 PM)
Hmm do you know what the habit of smoking does to electronic components? I won't even think what it will do to CDs...

From what I've seen it leaves a non-removable very visible haze on the discs once they have been heated up in a drive (CD, DVD, etc). The haze appears almost instantly . The discs seem to still work correctly however I don't know for how long they will work without problems.


--------------------
Complexity of incoherent design.
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Oge_user
post Jan 2 2003, 19:33
Post #20


A/V Moderator


Group: Members
Posts: 317
Joined: 20-August 02
Member No.: 3123



A good thing should be that the cd-r productions industries stops to claim their cds as life guaranteed, protected with azo etc. and starts to use better materials.. so they resist (more) to fingerprints and degradation..

I have some Verbatim cd-r that give a lot of errors when i read them in summer (very weird).. wink.gif


--------------------
[ Commodore 64 Forever...! ]
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post

Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 20th December 2014 - 17:51