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I heart foo_dsp_delta!, Thanks ssamadhi97
neoufo51
post Feb 27 2005, 10:52
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I found the Noise Sharpening DSP on this component to be one of the main reasons I love foobar2000. I don't think I can listen to mp3's without it!

I highly recommend it to anybody.
http://pelit.koillismaa.fi/plugins/dsp.php#92
(for foobar2000 0.8.3)

To the developer, thanks so much for this great plugin. biggrin.gif

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http://foosion.foobar2000.org/components/
(for foobar2000 0.9.5 and newer)


moderation: updated download link for foobar2000 0.9.5 version

This post has been edited by foosion: Oct 24 2008, 15:24
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Insolent
post Feb 27 2005, 14:10
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Wow! That DSP is awesome. I'm usually not one for DSPs (in fact all I had before was just crossfading via DirectSound v2.0), but I must say I'll be keeping this one. Thanks. happy.gif


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neoufo51
post Feb 27 2005, 14:58
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QUOTE (Insolent @ Feb 27 2005, 06:10 AM)
Wow! That DSP is awesome. I'm usually not one for DSPs (in fact all I had before was just crossfading via DirectSound v2.0), but I must say I'll be keeping this one. Thanks. happy.gif
*

I was the same way myself.

Here's something interesting. I publicized this plugin in another well known forum and I'm currently getting all sorts of responses with people saying that they will leave Winamp AND ITunes for Foobar2000 since their music sounds so much better with this component. Some are even asking for a port, and I of course gave credit to the developer and pointed them to his page.

This post has been edited by neoufo51: Feb 27 2005, 15:01
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DeepDose
post Feb 27 2005, 15:03
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I thought I'd try this out.....I only needed a slight enhanced...as my setup is pretty prime.....this is pretty good stuff.....everyone should leave winamp lol
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spase
post Feb 27 2005, 17:17
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haha yeah.

its cool what a little fun with mathematics can do

hmm

maybe ssamadhi97 is a mathemagician?

(simpsons anyone?)


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Sandman2012
post Feb 27 2005, 19:02
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heh-heh I saw that ep, spase. smile.gif

In any case I usually don't use DSPs or even EQ, but this one seems pretty subtle. I'll try it for a while and see how I like it. Can any of the hardcore audio guys here explain if this will affect clipping and such (the only other DSP I use in the stack is the Advanced Limiter)?
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Comanche -hM
post Feb 28 2005, 01:04
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it seems that the treble is a lot high in the musics, i turned the settings to 60% and now its all good, without the DSP enabled the treble in the music seem a little bit layed out or cutted off, something like that...

but i want some more tecnical explanations about, someone? tongue.gif
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acedriver
post Feb 28 2005, 06:53
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a good plugin.. 50% is enough for me..


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Insolent
post Feb 28 2005, 07:06
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QUOTE (Comanche -hM @ Feb 27 2005, 04:04 PM)
it seems that the treble is a lot high in the musics, i turned the settings to 60% and now its all good, without the DSP enabled the treble in the music seem a little bit layed out or cutted off, something like that...

but i want some more tecnical explanations about, someone?  tongue.gif
*

That's what I noticed -- the bass was seriously lacking. But setting it to around 60 evens it out a bit.


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wimms
post Feb 28 2005, 22:09
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QUOTE (Comanche -hM @ Feb 27 2005, 04:04 PM)
it seems that the treble is a lot high in the musics, i turned the settings to 60% and now its all good, without the DSP enabled the treble in the music seem a little bit layed out or cutted off, something like that...

but i want some more tecnical explanations about, someone?  tongue.gif
Hehe, I'm tempted to create a snake oil urban legend around it cool.gif wonder how long it takes before this will become a "fact" laugh.gif

/tongue in cheek/
You see, the oversampling DAC you most certainly use has to unavoidably do some digital filtering on the signal to do its job, which resembles something opposite to what this dsp does - and as a side affect is causing music a little bit layed out or cutted off in highs, something like that... So this noise sharpening is sorta undoing the damage by predistorting the signal in a manner that gets again undone by the DAC later. In effect, you get "more realistic" music, "as it was recorded". Now you can get the glimpse of why many audiophiles accept only non-oversampling purist DACs. And, um, you can get that without spending $$$$ now.
dry.gif
/tongue in cheek/

Well, in reality, you experience loudness race in its purest form - that which sounds louder feels to sound better. You get used to it very fast, and turning back is pain.
It mixes derivative of the signal (difference to previous sample) with signal itself. Amplitude of this derivative is higher with higher frequencies, thats why only treble is notably affected.
It is a sort of equalizer that increases treble in dependence to high frequency content amplitude - higher amplitude signals get increased more than lower amplitude content. It feels like "curtain has been unvelied" laugh.gif
Anyone remember Dolby B in tapes sounding better without undoing Dolby compression?


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Rash
post Mar 1 2005, 00:09
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So, wimms, are you saying that this "increase in treble" is more correct? Is a more realistic sound?


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wimms
post Mar 1 2005, 11:15
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http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=tongue-in-cheek


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MrEnergizer
post Mar 2 2005, 00:14
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yeah im liking this for now....will test it out properly only using it at 40% as I set my eq high on tops (treble) anyway.
Nice plugin smile.gif
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gizbug
post Mar 24 2005, 00:25
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QUOTE (neoufo51 @ Feb 27 2005, 05:52 AM)
I found the Noise Sharpening DSP on this component to be one of the main reasons I love foobar2000. I don't think I can listen to mp3's without it!

I highly recommend it to anybody.
http://pelit.koillismaa.fi/plugins/dsp.php#92

To the developer, thanks so much for this great plugin.  biggrin.gif
*



How do I set this up? There we 3 components added to the list. 2 give me no bass and high trebile, 1 gives me way too much bass.....
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ssamadhi97
post Mar 24 2005, 00:55
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QUOTE (gizbug @ Mar 24 2005, 12:25 AM)
How do I set this up? There we 3 components added to the list.  2 give me no bass and high trebile, 1 gives me way too much bass.....
*


There should be a 4th new entry in the dsp list, Noise sharpening, which is the one these people here are enjoying. Glad you people like it, btw.

(as for other questions etc in this thread, I'll answer after some sleep.. if I don't forget to)


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waileongyeo
post Mar 24 2005, 10:44
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QUOTE (gizbug @ Mar 24 2005, 07:25 AM)
How do I set this up? There we 3 components added to the list.  2 give me no bass and high trebile, 1 gives me way too much bass.....
*


@ssamadhi97,
I got the 4th entry in the dsp list. wink.gif However, I am also confused by these 4 entries, seems like the "integrate" MUST to be used with EITHER "differentiate" or "diff; safe". I put "Noise sharpening" after two of these.

i.e.
1. convert LPCM to delta-PCM (differentiate)
2. convert delta-PCM to LPCM (integrate)
3. Noise sharpening (how many % is the best?? My default is 100. blink.gif )

This is the best combination I get so far, pls advice me if you got better configuration or sequence of the entries to be loaded in dsp manager.

Thanks. smile.gif
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ep0ch
post Mar 24 2005, 11:10
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Won't the first two just be cancelling each other out? So remove them - they shouldn't be needed, just use Noise Sharpening on its own.
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p0wder
post Mar 24 2005, 11:50
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I set it to 40. Sounds great. smile.gif
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ssamadhi97
post Mar 24 2005, 14:31
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QUOTE (ep0ch @ Mar 24 2005, 11:10 AM)
Won't the first two just be cancelling each other out? So remove them - they shouldn't be needed, just use Noise Sharpening on its own.
*

Indeed. If f(t) is your input audio signal (t = time), the output of the functions is as follows:

Convert LPCM to delta-PCM (differentiate): f'(t)
Convert delta-PCM to LPCM (integrate): F(t)
Noise sharpening: f(t) + f'(t)

I implemented the first one because it was requested (by wimms iirc), the second one as a means to test whether the first one works properly etc, and the third one.. dunno.. because I was bored and felt like playing around with this stuff.

And indeed, Noise sharpening can/should be used alone.


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Andrea
post Mar 24 2005, 16:18
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Wow! Nice plugin! 40% is good for me too smile.gif


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Borisz
post Mar 24 2005, 17:04
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wow, this indeed makes the sound sharper. Nice work there.


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waileongyeo
post Mar 24 2005, 17:21
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QUOTE (ssamadhi97 @ Mar 24 2005, 09:31 PM)
Noise sharpening: f(t) + f'(t)
*

Isn't this means I asked my foobar to do a double job here? haaa.. laugh.gif

Now I removed any "integrate" & "diff" and leave the Noise sharpening works great!
Thanks to pointing this out else I'm still in blur.. blink.gif
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Borisz
post Mar 24 2005, 18:22
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hmm, it seems that some tunes, especially ones with already high treble on them get too clear with this plugin, and sound worse then they should be. Vinyl and MIDI recordings seem to suffer from this it seems. (MFSL Beatles recordings, Doom 2 midi recordings)


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viveztigrou
post Mar 24 2005, 19:26
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Hi guys, I love foobar2000 but perharps am not I as good an audiophile-tester as you all dudes!
so here is my config:

Jimi Hendrix - Stepping Stone (mpc 1.15v insane profile) cool.gif
creative soundblaster live! 24 bits external
24 bits (no dither) @ 48000 khz SRC (Sinc best) Resampler -> directsound 2.5 output



Have I well done?
Thanks for your forum, your time and your help!

Sylvain, France

This post has been edited by viveztigrou: Mar 24 2005, 19:34


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kl33per
post Mar 25 2005, 11:08
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Take out "convert LPCM to delta-PCM (diff; safe)" & "convert delta-PCM to LPCM (integrate)"


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