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[seemingly abandonware] iPod manager, also known as foo_dop
drbeachboy
post Jun 3 2006, 00:38
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Hi musicmusic,

The rewrite on my 4G 20gb was perfect. All looked and played as it should. I already had a 4.7 version DB created from foo_pod, so I really did not expect to have any issues there. It's great to see that you are making some serious progress with foo_dop. Also, I'll take a slow drive scan over a slow DB read anyday. tongue.gif

Thanks again! smile.gif

QUOTE (Apo @ Jun 2 2006, 16:00) *
4G, 20gb, tested the rewrite feature. Didn't break anything smile.gif
Can you add a feature so I can specify what tags it writes? It would be great if I could make it write "%album% CD%disc%" in the album tags smile.gif

Neither foo_dop, foo_pod nor iTunes for that matter, writes tags to an iPod. Rather, it writes a database file that accesses the music played on the iPod. Any tagging program will do what you are asking, and even foobar2000 itself.

This post has been edited by drbeachboy: Jun 3 2006, 00:40


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elishnevsky
post Jun 3 2006, 03:19
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Tried with my iPod Nano 2GB. So far so good. Actually, it's perfect! smile.gif I'm not even going to bother with restoring the backup database. What's the point? smile.gif
Keep it up, musicmusic!!! We all are counting on you wink.gif
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Sandman2012
post Jun 3 2006, 06:39
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musicmusic, between this and columns ui I've decided if you were a chick I'd have the hots for you. laugh.gif
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Apo
post Jun 3 2006, 16:46
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QUOTE (drbeachboy @ Jun 3 2006, 01:38) *
Neither foo_dop, foo_pod nor iTunes for that matter, writes tags to an iPod. Rather, it writes a database file that accesses the music played on the iPod. Any tagging program will do what you are asking, and even foobar2000 itself.


I know, I just wanted to express that I'd like to be able to change what foo_dop writes to that database.
Sorry if I put it wrong. ^^;
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musicmusic
post Jun 3 2006, 20:05
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Thanks for the tests and feedback people smile.gif

QUOTE (Apo @ Jun 2 2006, 20:00) *
Can you add a feature so I can specify what tags it writes? It would be great if I could make it write "%album% CD%disc%" in the album tags smile.gif

Its possible I guess. For the moment I would like to get some other basic functionality implemented before I do anything like this wink.gif


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Bl@ck_warrior
post Jun 3 2006, 20:21
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One thing that will be great is to have the possibility to send file to ipod as a file-tree customizable (%artist%/%album%/%tracknumer%-%title%) for example.

And then to create the itunes DB, so that it could work both with rockbox (with the filetree) and with the apple firware (with the itunes DB).
It will also have the possibility to see your files on the ipod and copy them back easily on any computer, instead of having the itunes architecture (h:/ipod_control/FC05/mdfj.m4a) wich sucks .

I know it's not for today but i think it will great and i know it's possible biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by Bl@ck_warrior: Jun 3 2006, 22:05


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Apo
post Jun 3 2006, 21:33
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QUOTE (Bl@ck_warrior @ Jun 3 2006, 21:21) *
One thing that will be great is to have the possibility to send file to ipod as a file-tree customizable (%artist%/%album%/%tracknumer%-%title% for example) and then to create the itunes DB, so that it could work both with rockbox (with the filetree) and with the apple firware (with the itunes DB).
It will also have the possibility to see your files on the ipod easily on any computer instead of the itunes architecture (h:/ipod_control/FC05/mdfjkd.m4a) wich sucks .

I know it's not for today but i think it will great and i know it's possible biggrin.gif


I think that's not possible, because the iPod firmware supports (AFAIK) only 4-letter-filenames (which is a pain when trying to copy your music back to your PC...)
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Bl@ck_warrior
post Jun 3 2006, 21:53
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Actually the firmware just use the itunes DB to find the music and if there are only 4letters filenames i think it's the apple protection so that you can't copy back your music easily.

I'm almost sure we can do that and that would be great biggrin.gif

QUOTE (RockBox Faq)
iTunes stores your music in the iPod_Control/Music folder on your iPod. You need to enable the "View all files" option to show this folder in the file browser.

However, iTunes obfuscates the filenames of your music by giving them names such as DLER.m4a in folders with names like F03. The folders do not match albums - the tracks are placed randomly in the different directory. The album/artist/title information is stored in a database file called itunesdb on your iPod. Rockbox currently does not read the information from this file.
[...]
Another solution to this problem was suggested by a user (Alan) in a discussion thread on the Rockbox iPod forum:

"I have a solution to this, you will need Foobar2000 v0.83 and the foo_pod plugin.

1. Copy all your files to the iPod using whatever directory structure you want.
2. Connect your iPod to the computer.
3. Load up Foobar2000, and select Components>foo_pod>Maintenance>Rebuild iTunesDB Database on iPod.
4. Foo_pod will then rebuild the iPod database with all your music files, but obviously only those that are recognised by the normal firmware of the iPod (AAC, MP3, ALAC etc).
5. You're done! One set of files accessible both by Rockbox and the normal iPod firmware.
6. Kiss me, I rule."

Note that foo_pod doesn't automatically create the necessary /iPodControl/iTunes directory, so if you've started from a clean iPod, you may need to create this directory by hand first yourself. Also note foo_pod has not been ported to foobar v0.9 and according to the foobar2000 forums, foo_pod development may be dead.


So if foo_dop could in the future send files to Ipod like the "move, rename or copy files", and then create the iTunesDB, we could have a tidy and convenient iPod working on the official firmware as well as on Rockbox firmware smile.gif

This post has been edited by Bl@ck_warrior: Jun 3 2006, 22:18


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david_dl
post Jun 3 2006, 22:31
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However that procedure has been proven to not work on iPods with recent firmware. It doesn't work on my 4G iPod, the tracks appear in the iPod database but when played it continually skips to the next track without playing anything.
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drbeachboy
post Jun 4 2006, 00:05
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QUOTE (david_dl @ Jun 3 2006, 17:31) *
However that procedure has been proven to not work on iPods with recent firmware. It doesn't work on my 4G iPod, the tracks appear in the iPod database but when played it continually skips to the next track without playing anything.

It works for me with the latest firmware, but I also use 4.7 version DB generated from foo_pod, and that is the reason that it works for me.

This post has been edited by drbeachboy: Jun 4 2006, 00:06


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richard123
post Jun 4 2006, 01:40
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QUOTE (david_dl @ Jun 3 2006, 16:31) *
However that procedure has been proven to not work on iPods with recent firmware. It doesn't work on my 4G iPod, the tracks appear in the iPod database but when played it continually skips to the next track without playing anything.
Where was this proven? More information, please
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Sandman2012
post Jun 4 2006, 02:02
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QUOTE (Apo @ Jun 3 2006, 13:33) *
I think that's not possible, because the iPod firmware supports (AFAIK) only 4-letter-filenames (which is a pain when trying to copy your music back to your PC...)

Yamipod is a nice freeware app for Windows, Mac and Linux that will copy music from your iPod to a hard drive with titles and metadata intact. It does a lot more as well.
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saratoga
post Jun 4 2006, 05:09
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I think the file name limit on the ipod's database is more like 20 characters.
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singaiya
post Jun 4 2006, 16:11
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I have a couple of questions:

1. How do you add new music to the ipod with this? With "Load library & playlists" it did exactly that. I tried dropping new files in the "iPod media library" and then doing "Rewrite Ipod database". It seemed to reload all the music on it since it took a long time, but the new files I dropped never made it to the ipod.

2. Is there a way to put videos on with foo_dop?

Thanks so much for foo_dop. I'd love to come back from itunes!
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Bl@ck_warrior
post Jun 4 2006, 16:38
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1) 2) You can't for the moment

This post has been edited by Bl@ck_warrior: Jun 4 2006, 16:38


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drbeachboy
post Jun 4 2006, 16:48
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QUOTE (singaiya @ Jun 4 2006, 11:11) *
I have a couple of questions:

1. How do you add new music to the ipod with this? With "Load library & playlists" it did exactly that. I tried dropping new files in the "iPod media library" and then doing "Rewrite Ipod database". It seemed to reload all the music on it since it took a long time, but the new files I dropped never made it to the ipod.

2. Is there a way to put videos on with foo_dop?

Thanks so much for foo_dop. I'd love to come back from itunes!

This plugin is currently only being tested. It does not have full functionality at the moment. It currently only reads and rewrites the database for music already on the iPod. Feel free to join us in that testing. The author, "musicmusic" will keep you/us informed of improvements in functionality as the plugin progresses to maturity.

This post has been edited by drbeachboy: Jun 4 2006, 16:50


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singaiya
post Jun 4 2006, 16:53
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Thanks for the answers. Yes, it reads and rewrites the database perfectly on my 5g. I did notice that the video menu on the ipod was populated with the song list, just fyi.
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musicmusic
post Jun 5 2006, 00:47
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Regarding songs in custom locations: it seems to work on my iPod fine, actually. AFAIK the limit on the path is 56 characters excluding drive letter and colon.

QUOTE (singaiya @ Jun 4 2006, 16:11) *
2. Is there a way to put videos on with foo_dop?
At the end of the day, foobar2000 is an audio player. So I wouldn't expect that feature wink.gif

QUOTE (singaiya @ Jun 4 2006, 16:53) *
Thanks for the answers. Yes, it reads and rewrites the database perfectly on my 5g. I did notice that the video menu on the ipod was populated with the song list, just fyi.

Thanks for testing on your 5G. Yes I expected it wouldn't work great on a 5G currently. I'll fix that in a few versions time when I switch to writing a later version of the database wink.gif


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prawns
post Jun 5 2006, 09:51
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QUOTE (musicmusic @ Jun 5 2006, 00:47) *
At the end of the day, foobar2000 is an audio player. So I wouldn't expect that feature wink.gif
I'm thinking about getting an iPod, so correct me if I'm wrong but does the iPod sort videos in a similar way to audio. For instance, your video file is placed on the iPod and then the way that the firmware recognises it, is by using iTunesDB file? If this is true, would it be possible to add some function to just write something in the iTunesDB to point to the file. E.G. you place the file on the iPod yourself then use foo_dop to tell the iPod it's location. Obviously it's a feature for down the road (if of course you want to implement it wink.gif) but at least that would mean I could do all my updating through foobar2000.
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Crissaegrim
post Jun 8 2006, 05:37
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Wow.. it's finally taking shape. biggrin.gif Thank you~ :3 Now, what about transcoding? biggrin.gif Coz I only have lossless on my foobar. T_T
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kode54
post Jun 8 2006, 08:19
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And to make it increasingly ridiculous, while still remaining useful:
  • Use the existing converter, with custom default presets for only supported formats.
  • No tagging for the converted files, since all the information will be transferred from the original files to the iPod's database.
  • Cache up to N files or N megabytes worth of transcoded files in a configurable directory. Files will be named according to a hash of the original file's name and/or tags, size, and last modification timestamp, something that can be quickly generated. Any time a transcode already exists, its modification time will be retouched to the current time, as transcodes can be deleted after a configurable number of days, and when a new file exceeds the cache size maximum, the oldest file will be deleted.

I told you it would get ridiculous.
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musicmusic
post Jun 8 2006, 17:30
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QUOTE (prawns @ Jun 5 2006, 09:51) *
I'm thinking about getting an iPod, so correct me if I'm wrong but does the iPod sort videos in a similar way to audio.
I don't own a 5G iPod. But from I have seen, I would say it does.

QUOTE (prawns @ Jun 5 2006, 09:51) *
If this is true, would it be possible to add some function to just write something in the iTunesDB to point to the file. E.G. you place the file on the iPod yourself then use foo_dop to tell the iPod it's location.

Problem is, you really need more than just the path to put them in the database properly. I need to identify videos from songs, as well as fill the database with the standard metadata and categorise them (TV Show, Music Video, ..). So true I don't really need foobar2000 to be able to play videos, but at least recognise them (as video files).

QUOTE (Crissaegrim @ Jun 8 2006, 05:37) *
Wow.. it's finally taking shape. biggrin.gif Thank you~ :3 Now, what about transcoding? biggrin.gif Coz I only have lossless on my foobar. T_T
I think there's a little while yet before I think about things like that wink.gif

QUOTE (kode54 @ Jun 8 2006, 08:19) *
And to make it increasingly ridiculous, while still remaining useful:
[*]Use the existing converter, with custom default presets for only supported formats.
I thought I read someone complaining about no converter API ?
QUOTE (kode54 @ Jun 8 2006, 08:19) *
[*]No tagging for the converted files, since all the information will be transferred from the original files to the iPod's database.
Still, if you want to rebuild the database, play files of the iPod on your computer, or something.
QUOTE (kode54 @ Jun 8 2006, 08:19) *
[*]Cache up to N files or N megabytes worth of transcoded files in a configurable directory. Files will be named according to a hash of the original file's name and/or tags, size, and last modification timestamp, something that can be quickly generated. Any time a transcode already exists, its modification time will be retouched to the current time, as transcodes can be deleted after a configurable number of days, and when a new file exceeds the cache size maximum, the oldest file will be deleted.
I told you it would get ridiculous.

AFAIK what foo_pod did was name the file on the iPod by some hash of the original file. I don't know though; if you re tag your files, you don't exactly want to convert them again, but Im not sure if there is actually anything practical I could do about that..

Personally I just keep transcoded copies of whatever on my hard drive, less hassle I thought but you have redundancy / consistency issues..

This post has been edited by musicmusic: Jun 8 2006, 17:39


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prawns
post Jun 8 2006, 19:15
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Ah ok then smile.gif I don't suppose I'd use the video function that much anyway. Now for another matter... is it worth £200..? (rhetorical)

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Crissaegrim
post Jun 8 2006, 19:53
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QUOTE (prawns @ Jun 8 2006, 13:15) *
Ah ok then smile.gif I don't suppose I'd use the video function that much anyway. Now for another matter... is it worth £200..? (rhetorical)
Depends... You're just paying a lot of it for the design. There's no question that it's stylish. It's designed very well. The controls are intuitive. But if you don't care about style, you can get the same function for much less.
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musicmusic
post Jun 8 2006, 23:09
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0.1.7 released wink.gif Details above.

For the moment, I wouldn't recommend 5G users use it at all until I add iTunes 4.9 database reading/writing. For everyone else its still entirely experimental, and expect the worst wink.gif


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